| 09 March 2003 at 08.28.54 ZuluTime
|
Posted by Gremlin [12.211.200.127 - 12-211-200-127.client.attbi.com] on 09 March 2003 at 08.28.54 ZuluTime:
...but it happens....
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:43:43 gremlin_net, limb0 --Gremlin
evilcoffeechick :
irrefragabilis :
ondoher2 :
sodapoprp : ok
jaydmoore : you originally said that.. "nobody can know the existance of god".. (own words).. I said that... "agnostics believe that they are ignorant on the subject of god"... we said the same thing in two different ways
jaydmoore : because we are both correct
gremlin_net : Hello.
zsa_zsa_galore2002 : grem
sodapoprp : does time always go on
kain_sagel : The belief that I will not let some made up God get in the way of my sanity
blackheartedprofit : given the evidence that exists, or lack of it in this case, i say there is no god
trent1of6 : Who made up God?
sodapoprp : when did it start
trent1of6 : I wonder if God made Himself?
primeval_water : When the thing that satisfies is external then self destined for satisfaction seems scientific, but this is not control, or temperance
kain_sagel : Or my family
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:44:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
kain_sagel : Just read Luke 14:26
triciabeeblebrox : primatives, who also thought the world was flat
gremlin_net : trent1of6: people who wanted easy answers to difficult questions.
esotericx10 : blackheartedprofit yes and its an arrogant conclusion
kain_sagel : That makes me hate the Bible even more, every day!
sodapoprp : reasite luke 14:26
sara2smile2 : wb
dasein_the_first : God sitting from the eternity... that's quite a walk to the toilet
fish_pussy : who said some fantasy cant be reality while most poeples reality is actually fantasy
blackheartedprofit : i don't think so esotericx10, i just think you are too weak to make up your mind
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:45:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
tertullian_2002 : :D
jaydmoore : feels kinda stupid about that ridiculous argument... but isn't worried... is drunk
cynikal_mind : the petty philosophies of man are meaningless in the history of this present universe, much LESS those that have certainly come before.... (granted it's an assumption, but no idea is perfect;))
trent1of6 : Gremlin..Perhaps they experienced a revelation... that will never occur to close minds like yours
fish_pussy : we dont know
brujo_malo : I don't hate the Bible... I just feel better when it's not around
gremlin_net : trent1of6: yeah. It's called temporal lobe epilepsy.
lil_miss_atheist : the bible burns my skin >:)
cynikal_mind : fliverous#-o
fish_pussy : am i a figment of your imagination or are u a figment of mine
lil_miss_atheist : :)) stan
kain_sagel : I hate peoples' idea's about the Bible
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:46:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : the Bible has a permanent resting place under my tennis-shoes
esotericx10 : blackheartedprofit My mind will be made up when I have enough data to make it up...which means ?I won't conclude from a [position of ignrance like you've chosen to do
blackheartedprofit : this supposed god that created everything and wants us to worship him/her/it, would only have to prove it's existence, and the problem would be solved
gaston_45 : kain, it is great porn, nothing wrong with the bible
jaydmoore : so it can't burn my skin
trent1of6 : Gremlin.. your sad.. and blinded by things of Earth... blinded by your 5 senses... open yourself
lil_miss_atheist : lol
brujo_malo : there's not enough martial arts in the Bible
gremlin_net : trent1of6: 'your' is an adjective.
kain_sagel : lol Gaston
fish_pussy : is this all a test sort of like virtual reality
blackheartedprofit : if you want to call me ignorant, eso, at least learn to spell it correctly
trent1of6 : excuse me.. "you're"
brujo_malo : Jesus should've known drunken monkey technique
cynikal_mind : god knows that he's god and conspirator knows that he's god... a majority of two=P~
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:47:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
indondasani : is away (Away)
jaydmoore : Jesus was a pussy
primeval_water : The way the words look when you get to see it translated back into, say, greek, makes the statement of it more threatening, more evocative of reverence in the reader
jaydmoore : he didn't know any technique
indondasani : is back
indondasani : is not away.
dasein_the_first : Gaston?
gremlin_net : trent1of6: have you got any evidence of deities, or are you just misspelling things out of your ass?
jaydmoore : thinks that indon IS away
jaydmoore : he's lying
tony_met2002 : offers conspiratorworks a big bowl of warm milk along with his medications
kain_sagel : There is to many Atheists in the roome to have fun with the Christians
trent1of6 : Sure I have evidence of My own...... Personal Experience...
esotericx10 : blackheartedprofit there is nothing wrong with my spelling...and that isn't the issue is it...however if you want to take issue with my typing skills please fell free to do so
jaydmoore : there are(
primeval_water : This sort of everydayish language that the King James version gives makes the book literature, and not a warning.
jaydmoore : are*
indondasani : jayd; yes, you're right.
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:48:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
esotericx10 : *feel
cynikal_mind : conspirator, welcome to the Lion's Den
signofthescorpion : If the supernateral does not exist ... the same damn question.. why shouldn't it? Sceptics have never ever even tried to study any of the hundreds of subjects of Esp, Obe.. Astral Projection especially, is like a proof that is waiting there for everyone to discover.. Patience and will power of actually at least trying to do anything of it, is all thats needed.
gremlin_net : trent1of6: personal experience is subjective. I mean real evidence.
gremlin_net : signofthescorpion: that's a lie.
signofthescorpion : Explain gremlin..
jaydmoore : kain, you should recruit some xians
sara2smile2 : Why should it worry the "room" when someone is sure about what THEY believe to be the truth?
trent1of6 : Oh... well, to me it's real evidence.... Maybe you should look for yourself.. Gremlin.. INstead of Looking in other people
jaydmoore : try to balance it out
gremlin_net : signofthescorpion: we've made every attempt to study those claims. Most of them evaporate immediately.
tertullian_2002 : agreed sara
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:49:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
indondasani : many 'supernatural' phenomena have been studied scientifically.
cynikal_mind : I smell a mental meltdown in progress...
signofthescorpion : Thats because no-one has ever even tried to attempt it
brujo_malo : sara, because they sometimes expect everyone else to believe the same "truth"
signofthescorpion : that is sceptic
gremlin_net : trent1of6: I do. And there's no credible evidence that any deities have ever existed.
jaydmoore : supernatural is a contradiction in terms, in itself
sara2smile2 : brujo, and this harms us how?
primeval_water : I suppose that that that is deemed science must contain an offering of an conclusion
amazing_live_sea_monkey : Well said, eso.
jaydmoore : even if something "supernatural" were to be evidenced, it would no longer be "supernatural"
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:50:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
signofthescorpion : Exactly
brujo_malo : well... I don't want to believe a bunch of nonsense as "truth"
sara2smile2 : unless they have a gun to my head it doesn't hurt me that someone really really believes or really really doesnt
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: so 'supernatural' is synonymous with 'fraudulent'?
jaydmoore : that whole "randi test" is a sham
jaydmoore : no, grem
indondasani : or at least with "unverified".
jaydmoore : just, impossible
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:51:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
brujo_malo : not true sara - if you believe that walking in traffic won't harm you, by all means, do so - but I choose to believe otherwise
cynikal_mind : the SHARKS smell BLOOD....
jaydmoore : grem knew where I was going with that one
trent1of6 : Gremlin... I personally have chosen to believe LIFE is evidence of a Deity... to me the delicacy and inprobability of the necessary elements to coorespond in the way they do reveals the possibility of a PURPose
primeval_water : You'll discover of belief, though deeply heartfelt, is exclusive
gremlin_net : trent1of6: good for you. But that still makes for baseless assertions in debates.
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:52:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
brujo_malo : I guess it's not harmful to believe that the holocaust didn't happen - let's teach that as an "alternative" in history classes
sara2smile2 : brujo,and how has MY belief harmed you? and how has stating it vehemently hurt ?
trent1of6 : True Gremlin... I believe finding "GOD" is a personal Voyage
random_stan : not me
tertullian_2002 : who was it
gremlin_net : trent1of6: okay. It's still baseless.
brujo_malo : I never said your belief harmed me
trent1of6 : NO FACTS will ever be able to prove that GOd does or doesnt exist... just find out for youself is all I know
brujo_malo : I said it's harmful when people expect others to believe as they do
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:53:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
sara2smile2 : brujo, why exactly?
cynikal_mind : mental meltdown avoided....=D>
gaston_45 : trent, god is in the same category as santa claus
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: what you have to realise is that 'supernatural' is a genre. Ghosts, goblins, or whatever. Prove goblins to exist, and they'll be considered natural; they'll still be goblins though. That's the point.
tertullian_2002 : goes book shopping...listening
brujo_malo : If you believe Jesus, not doctors, can cure appendicitis, then you might one day put your children in harm's way
practidel : god is a filing system, and its actions are manifested by the subconscious mind, often to the individual's amazement
gremlin_net : trent1of6: no facts are required to prove that deities don't exist. There's no need to disprove the unproved.
jaydmoore : it's STILL a contradition in terms, grem
jaydmoore : and THAT is MY point
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:54:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: proving the supernatural is like learning the unknown.
trent1of6 : Gaston... To you God is... but personal experience has let God become more believable to me
tony_met2002 : consirator you said"if god exists,I believe that god has faith in himself"/ that shows doubt in a god,and moreso ,why would god need with faith?
esotericx10 : sara2smile2 it is harmful because entire cultures have been destroyed because they didn't share your beliefs
trent1of6 : Gremlin... Then, Unprove Me
jaydmoore : no, grem, proving the supernatural is like proving the "something that exists beyond the bounds of reality"
gaston_45 : why? did he sit down and have a beer with you??
gaston_45 : man, I have been trying to get that for years!
gremlin_net : trent1of6: okay. Here's your shirt: http://troll.grem.tv
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:55:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gaston_45 : got a lot to discuss with the man
gremlin_net : trent1of6 has been unproved until June 2031.
primeval_water : That's the difference between the word power and the word strength
gaston_45 : sara, religions are dangerous
tony_met2002 : conspirator you said"if god exists,I believe that god has faith in himself"/ that shows doubt in a god,and moreso ,why would god need faith?
jaydmoore : "supernatural" is an invalid word in itself
gaston_45 : look at jones town
signofthescorpion : Agrees with J.d
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:56:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gaston_45 : or the middle east
sara2smile2 : why does.... you wanting me to believe like you or me wanting the opposite naturally lead one of us to inflicting those beliefs in a harmful way?
signofthescorpion : No such thing.. nonsense
brujo_malo : shit, look at the south
practidel : a human construct -- people must deal with god, because that's how they are hardwired. So why not lord it over ourselves to create agod everyone can live with using the most widely shared beliefs
spherical_book : I think the word "supernatural" is nonsensical also. You can explain it on paper, but much like a circle, it does not exist in reality.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: you're focussing on the word. Look at the concept. Pick any given baseless assertion. Then prove that to be true. That's the issue here.
blackheartedprofit : theists should keep their theistic beliefs to themselves
dasein_the_first : my mic is messing up and conspirator is an idiot... so I'm going to go.... lil miss I'll hump your leg later
jaydmoore : legalities are formed on words, grem
cynikal_mind : conspirator, ALL CONJECTURE
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:57:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
sara2smile2 : why blackhearted?
jaydmoore : you don't draw up a contract with stereotypes
gaston_45 : yes trent, that is generally considered good science
jaydmoore : THAT is the issue here
tony_met2002 : agreed ,stan
blackheartedprofit : because they have no right to inflict their beliefs on others, sara
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: okay. So your concern is that the supernatural can't exist, by definition?
primeval_water : Yeah, but. . . theres always a sort of threat there, humanity is legendary to irself as omnipotently injust
gaston_45 : if you can't see it, taste it, touch it or hear it then does it exist?
jaydmoore : exactly
indondasani : yet another reason why Bush hates the constitution: http://snopes.com/religion/jesusday.htm
cynikal_mind : lucky us, stan
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: then we're agreed.
strawberryclamdandy : Bloody yahoo and its 40 user limit....
sara2smile2 : Does the very fact that a believer wants others to believe or vice versa necessarily mean I am going to harm you trying to make that happen?
jaydmoore : alright
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:58:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
esotericx10 : sara2smile2 because it is a form of personal assult the same as if I violated your person by touching you where you don't want to be touched
jaydmoore : furthermore, I think that the "randi test" is a sham
gaston_45 : no trent, little kids believe in monsters under the bed, does that mean they exist?
esotericx10 : *assault
blackheartedprofit : its not a matter of harm sara,
triciabeeblebrox : why are the pagan gods, and the roman gods, and the greek gods, etc. considered to be hogwash, but we are supposed to accept the christain god? as if the story of this god is not just as ludicrous, as the others?
practidel : the biblical god is dysfunctional, especially in the 21st century
blackheartedprofit : it's a matter of personal rights
sara2smile2 : esoteric, what is like touching thats not touching?
fish_pussy : i see right thru it
gaston_45 : god is just the monster under the bed that is repackaged to be acceptable to adults
spherical_book : indon, Both Repubs and Dems are fundamentally opposed to the Constitution, but especially Dems.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: you assume it's a sham, based on what you conjecture it to entail.
signofthescorpion : What about expressing opinion? Its not what is believed, often because they, I know, Its not about belief.. but knowledge and expeniance.. I believe what I see and acheve.. and yes Esp is what I have
ginxyz2000 : Howdy folks
jaydmoore : because no "legally binding" contract is drawn up on a falsification.. unless the person ensuing is a fraud
cynikal_mind : god says, Love Me or DIE, DIE, DIE!! man, that's beautiful:x
primal_nature38802 : most non-believers view christianity and other religions as very perverse.
LOG DATA Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:59:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
indondasani : spherical; how so?
gaston_45 : no trent, probbably not, no evidence of love
indondasani : doesn't see anything that the democrats do which is worse than trying to turn the nation into a theocracy.
primeval_water : Kaballah, Qaballah, Qabballah, Kabbalah, Qabbalah, Cabalah, Caballah, Cabbalah, Kabalah
jaydmoore : but then again, grem, I haven't read the contract
spherical_book : Indon, how so what?
esotericx10 : sara2smile2 Why are you playing coy with me when you know full well what I am talking about...? a mental assukt is just as intrusive as a physical one
gremlin_net : Most believers view christianity as perverse, too.
jaydmoore : I don't know the specific wording
esotericx10 : *assault
indondasani : spherical; how are the democrats more opposed to the constitution than republicans?
triciabeeblebrox : love is an emotion, one could say its a biochemical response, along with other emotions
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:00:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gaston_45 : GOd did not say anything, a bunch of drunk guys wrote down what they said god said
blackheartedprofit : it doesn't hurt as much, eso, but it is certainly annoying
primal_nature38802 : If you claim something fantastic you should have fantastic evidence.
cynikal_mind : god says Love Me or ROT, ROT, ROT!!! man, that's beautiful:x
markextreme73 : hey candice,are you doing ok,you look under the weather
sara2smile2 : If I believe in the concept that charity is good and I would like esoteric to believe the same...how does that harm him?
gaston_45 : indo, right now both sides are opposed to it
spherical_book : Indon, Dems generally try to implement legislation that is not compatible with the Constitution.
practidel : a functional god might entail the most inclusive language, such as "god is life"
primal_nature38802 : If a person walked around preaching unicorns they would be considered insane.
jaydmoore : the challenge seems pretty clear to me, though... "prove the "supernatural", win 1 million bucks".. I say, IMPOSSIBLE
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:01:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
primal_nature38802 : But they preach a deity and they get unearned respect.
primal_nature38802 : I don't understand.
blackheartedprofit : you still have no right to hammer him with it, sara
sara2smile2 : and didnt know I knew how to play coy
esotericx10 : sara2smile2 You're being cuta again because yo know it doesn't stop there
strawberryclamdandy : Love could be viewed as a mixture of emotions. If its a chemical reaction, does that mean that if we isolated the chemicals and combined them they would create love ?
esotericx10 : *cute
indondasani : spherical; so, you don't have any actual examples of aims of the democratic party which is incompatible with the constitution.
tertullian_2002 : contradiction
gaston_45 : the dems attack the second amendment, the repubs attack the first, they both are still attacking the constitution
tony_met2002 : Ray you're employing convoluted logic
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: the challenge is to prove that which is *currently* considered to be supernatural to exist in reality. That proving a thing to exist would prevent it from being supernatural is immaterial. The sequence is to posit that a specific supernatural occurrance could be real, and then to show that it is real.
triciabeeblebrox : I think mankinds thinking has evolved, in the past, man had magical thinking, much as a child would today. I don't think man had reached concrete level of thinking, nor abstract, when they wrote the bible, at least the writers of the bible had not.
gaston_45 : indo, they are anti gun rights
markextreme73 : hey candice ,you there?
candice2027 : hi mark
tertullian_2002 : candice
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: if you were to assert that goblins were real, and therefore not supernatural, and then proved that goblins were real, then you'd win.
indondasani : gaston; the second amendment is easily interpreted as a reference to militia groups only.
sara2smile2 : esoteric, so you are saying that you can stop with just the wish for others to not believe but I cannot stop with just the wish?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:02:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gaston_45 : lol, trent, you didn't actually just say that ??????
brujo_malo : sara, what if esoteric believed charity is BAD and wanted to enact laws that banned others giving to charity?
gaston_45 : no indo, it is not
indondasani : yes, it is.
markextreme73 : hi candice,do you believe in god?
jaydmoore : oh, grem, so it could be reworded, more specifically (and more accurately), as "prove the 'extraordinary', and win 1 million bucks"?
blackheartedprofit : yes tricia, science has permeated mans everyday thoughts, thats why theism is on the decline worldwide
gaston_45 : itis written in plain english and the supreme court has even ruled it is an INDIVIDUAL right
indondasani : it even specifies in the event of foreign invasion.
sara2smile2 : brujo, does it affect MY charity?
practidel : why should spirituality be thought of as being separate from physical reality? The root of the word spirit implies something entirely physical (i.e., breath)
indondasani : gaston; and the supreme court could just as easily reinterpret it.
gaston_45 : no it doesn't indo
primeval_water : The most impossible is "Where did God come from," I mean, hey, people, who created God?
indondasani : they've done it before.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: it could be. Except that the 'extraordinary' has already been shown to occur.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:03:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
primeval_water : Satan, that's who.
spherical_book : Indon, whether it's gun control, health care, education reform, affirmative action, or most any other domestic agenda, you can't find the power to act in that area given by the Constitution to the federal government. I'd welcome you to show me where any of this is granted in the Constitution.
triciabeeblebrox : I think scienctific paranormal studies, may shed some light on it someday
indondasani : sighs and goes online to get the exact wording.
jaydmoore : how so, grem?
brujo_malo : well, "laws that banned others giving to charity" would probably include you
strawberryclamdandy : God apparently wasn't created
markextreme73 : hey candice,are you there?
tony_met2002 : what took god so long?
candice2027 : mark
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: the point of the contest is to pick a specific assertion which would be called supernatural, and then prove that assertion to be true.
gaston_45 : "A well regulated millitia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed"
gaston_45 : there it is indo
indondasani : spherical; the federal government has a number of completely legal control tactics over local governments.
strawberryclamdandy : That's why some religions refer to God as the uncreate
indondasani : gaston; a well-regulated militia.
candice2027 : lol
just_me_29670 : o snap
gaston_45 : that is the exact second amendment indo
jaydmoore : whatever, grem... LOL... we're splitting hairs
just_me_29670 : look how is here
ginxyz2000 : The extraordianry does happen...all the time as a matter of fact. Every person is a thermodynamic miracle.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:04:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
indondasani : not an unregulated group of individual citizens.
just_me_29670 : its me
jaydmoore : I think it's a sham
esotericx10 : sara2smile2 Im saying that it is the habit of practitioners of your religion to insist on preaching ot to whomever they encounter...and when this behavior isrebuked that it doesn't cease but is redoubled...this is a complete lack of respect for anothers wishes
cynikal_mind : conspirator, what is the difference between this so-called "truth" and a story you might make up as you go along?
strawberryclamdandy : He wasn't created
just_me_29670 : hiihihihi everyone
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: 'extraordinary' is just 'unusual, but good'.
triciabeeblebrox : hi indon
jaydmoore : I think it could be worded more properly
signofthescorpion : Thats is incorrect practical.. Spirituality difines greatly wide variations of everything.. Including Ethereal existance
indondasani : I don't see anything in that amendment which prevents firearms regulation.
gaston_45 : indo, that is exactly what the militia is, all males between 18 and 44, look it up
indondasani : hello, tricia.
sara2smile2 : there are those here that are incensed by just hearing or reading that someone has faith, how are they harmed?
gaston_45 : shall not be infringed indo, it is right there
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: the actual contract *is* worded more properly. The advert is worded so that morons understand the idea.
markextreme73 : god loves us all,sometimes,people don't believe in him ,but he still believes in us
indondasani : gaston; well-regulated.
jaydmoore : "unusual, but good"????
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:05:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gaston_45 : look that one up too indo, it means well trained
jesus_freak0531 : Hallelujah mark
gaston_45 : skilled in an art
cynikal_mind : conspirator, what is the difference between this so-called "truth" and a story you might make up as you go along?
triciabeeblebrox : no time for me to learn battletech this weekend, have been busy playing nanny to Chief's kids.
jaydmoore : I figured it may be as such, grem
practidel : now that the physical realm includes quantum reality, god may be thought to omnipresent, in everyone
indondasani : or, it means 'regulated'.
esotericx10 : sara2smile2 If they are incensed then its because they have had encounters wirth others of your kind
brujo_malo : I get incensed because some people have faith in some pretty ridiculous shit and they expect it to be taken seriously
triciabeeblebrox : got a lot of excersise
just_me_29670 : alcy candice esotreix gremlin hunter jd lill miss primal radarray repty sara rev stan tony trent hihihihi every one
indondasani : it is, as I said earlier, a matter of interpretation.
tertullian_2002 : hey justin
jaydmoore : basically, "you present a BRAND NEW idea, you win 1 million bucks
javiersito12 : candice invite to see ur webcam!
spherical_book : I find the Repub "agenda" to be distasteful also. I'm a pretty hardcore libertarian. Libertarianism is where it's at.
esotericx10 : sara2smile2 they recognize the abuse they are about to be subjected to
cynikal_mind : conspirator, what is the difference between this so-called "truth" and a story you might make up as you go along?
javiersito12 : please
indondasani : but, the wording in the constitution was often left vague such as this.
jaydmoore : physics wise
triciabeeblebrox : although they play with their K'NEX Mechs
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:06:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : something "supernatural"
just_me_29670 : stan lol
gaston_45 : those are preperatory statements indo, the right is of the people to keep anndbear arms shall not be infringed, the other statements just give you a reason why
triciabeeblebrox : I want one to, to learn how to build things
triciabeeblebrox : plus they are cool looking
tony_met2002 : trent1of6 I don't have a belief,but I di know that you can not prove this god
esotericx10 : just_me_29670 hello
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: no. You present a hypothesis that a given thing which has been labelled as being supernatural is, in fact, natural; then you prove that hypothesis to be true. Then you win.
indondasani : prepatory statements?
markextreme73 : pray to him candice ,he will listen ,there is nothing so wrong that he won't ,he is a forgiven god now
just_me_29670 : stan your vioce sounds just like aome one i know in realife named aaron you would not happen to really be him would you
just_me_29670 : eso hi
triciabeeblebrox : the oldest boy still needs to put his together, I just hope all the tiny pieces do not get lost.
gaston_45 : so the right of the people to peacably assemble onyl ap[plies to the government indo?
jaydmoore : well yeah, grem, you've got to follow the scientific method and establish yourself
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:07:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
just_me_29670 : just checking
indondasani : does the fact that those words come first make them any less part of the constitution?
jaydmoore : but it has to be unheard of
gaston_45 : yes indo, it is a statement that describes one that follows
indondasani : a statement which modifies the context of such a statement.
markextreme73 : hey everybody ,you guys going to church tommorrow
sara2smile2 : hey justin
just_me_29670 : sara hi
gaston_45 : it deos not modefy it
gaston_45 : it explains why
triciabeeblebrox : just because you are athiest, does not mean that you do not prescribe to a religion.
indondasani : all right. it PROVIDES context.
practidel : today's technology would be cnsidered magic by those living in Jesus' time. How much more will the technology two millenia from now be considered magic by us
cynikal_mind : retardacy:))
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:08:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: right. The contest isn't to prove the supernatural to exist, per se, because supernatural by definition means 'beyond existence'. The contest is to take a given supernatural thing, like ghosts or ESP, and show it to be natural and real.
gaston_45 : it explains why the right is listed there
sara2smile2 : lol at retardacy
jaydmoore : now, grem, here is the catcher... for that 1 million bones, what have you given him?
jaydmoore : all rights to the "discovery"
ginxyz2000 : "A suffciently advanced technology is industinguishable from magic."
ginxyz2000 : I love that quote.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: your assurance that you won't sue him for posting your evidence to his website.
jaydmoore : = much MORE money
markextreme73 : if you don't you sure don't know what your missing,i know going to a new church can be hard but you can do it my friends
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:09:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : all rights, grem
practidel : two millenia from now we could be no only god of this world, but god of the milky way
jaydmoore : he gains the copyright
tertullian_2002 : tony flew is a good author
jaydmoore : he collects
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: it doesn't work that way.
brujo_malo : going to church is a great place to meet women
gaston_45 : and what you are doing is the exact attack the dems are using on the constitution indo
tony_met2002 : I flew am a good author?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:10:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : and in the long run... you could have made much more money presenting infront of a credited university
gaston_45 : brujo, an orgy is a better place to meet women
indondasani : it's not an attack. it's a different interpretation.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: okay. Then go do that.
gaston_45 : at least there you know they put out,lol
markextreme73 : brujo,church was meant to worship the creator
jesus_freak0531 : hi
brujo_malo : pentecostal women who speak in tongues usually have an oral fixation
jaydmoore : how do you purpose that it does work, grem?
gaston_45 : attack through interpretation indo
indondasani : attack through interpretation?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: I've already explained it several times.
cynikal_mind : atheist = satanic baby killing cultists and you know it8-}
just_me_29670 : brb room
gaston_45 : how about I interpret the first amendment to only apply to the states right to free speech?
javiersito12 : :p
jaydmoore : in the event of success, grem?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:11:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
indondasani : and how would you do that?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: if you ever discover evidence of a heretofore supernatual event, then publish it your way. But don't feed the trolls with disinformation that this is a scam.
gaston_45 : and since the constitution only refers to men the it doesn't apply to women does it indo?
practidel : carl sagan
jaydmoore : do you suggest that the contestant makes money on the tests ran henceforth?
esotericx10 : gaston_45 They all put out...the question is finding the right key to unlock the door
primeval_water : Intially, there were fourty people, they were proto humans, eight of each species, mongol, negro, caucasoid, white and dark arab. The eighth couple would birth their great great grandparents. Each couple was birthed together, male and female, man and wife. The white arab was tempted by one of their gods and succumbed, chose to sin. . . these dieties were sad serving the protohumans, but when the white arab proto human sinned, it infected the dieities with animals, that's where the angels came from.
gaston_45 : that is what you are doing indo, why not do it to all the amendments?
try_anything_once1 : hey stan heres a book for ya. the all time best selling book in the world is... ta da... the bible=D> (wonder why) :-?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:12:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
indondasani : gaston; dictionaries note that "he" is the neuter pronoun.
jaydmoore : fuck it
jaydmoore : LOL
gaston_45 : all men are created equal indo
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: telling the trolls that it's a scam just gives them one more excuse to get out of providing evidence of their bullshit.
cynikal_mind : try anything, because there's a sucker born every minute
practidel : people want to believe in an afterlife, even if they risk a unpleasant one
gaston_45 : no mention of women so they aren't protected
jaydmoore : true, grem
spherical_book : Talking politics in chat is the worst. I could convert 1000 Christian missionaries on theological topics before I could sway a single person on a political topic.
jaydmoore : I shouldn't even be remarking in their interest
markextreme73 : bible,in greek it means the book for it is the only book you will ever need
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:13:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
primeval_water : No Bible scientist, not one ever, has once gotten past what they call Genesis chapter four
gaston_45 : yuo starting to see the problem with "interpreting" the constitution to mean something it doesn't so it agrees with your misconseptions?
indondasani : congress shall make no law abridging the freedom of speech. how can that be reinterpreted?
primeval_water : Now the Bible is over, we're in Revelation five.
indondasani : I noted how your male/female attempt wouldn't hold up in court.
cynikal_mind : not me, trent... not anymore anyway
jaydmoore : just like I should never mention about that whole "evidenced jesus" thing in here, either
cynikal_mind : (knock on wood)
jaydmoore : they'll jump on that like flies on shit
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:14:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
markextreme73 : science and god doesn't mix
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: if Elmer Dinkley of Rural Kentucky finds a goblin in his refurbised Philco, his options are to tell Randi about it, or keep it a secret. He's not going to understand that it can be peer-reviewed at the academic level. That's his own fault for being a moron. Let darwinism apply: idiots don't get paid.
jaydmoore : LOL
indondasani : and I would like to see you try to make a viable interpretation of the free speech clause in alignment with the one you claimed you could do.
gaston_45 : I was refering to the right of the people to peacably assemble and to petition the govt for redress indo
brujo_malo : alcohol and god don't mix
ginxyz2000 : They don't mix now, maybe...I think they'll mix someday.
esotericx10 : primeval_water Pray tell...what is a "Bible scientist"...i don't believe I've ever heard the term before...?
sara2smile2 : RAY ..READ???
indondasani : Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
tertullian_2002 : :))
sara2smile2 : lol
gaston_45 : if the people doesn't mean citizens in the second then it can't mean citizens in the first
brujo_malo : Mogen David made wine
indondasani : that means that Congress can't make laws abridging the people's rights to assemble and petition the government.
jaydmoore : very true, indon
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:15:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
practidel : the books of the bible were among the first babblings of infant civilization. We need a more progressive view
indondasani : what would the people mean?
gaston_45 : so the citizens have no right to assemble or petition the govt, only the states do right indo?
indondasani : how are states people?
jaydmoore : I believe that "supernatural" beings DO exist
jaydmoore : that's just me, though
primeval_water : They're people who investigate the transliterations, translations, and do comparative religion studies, trying to extrapol(i)ate a way to get past what they call Genesis chapter 4
gaston_45 : that is what you are claiming, that the people does not mean citizens right?
jaydmoore : I will need more time to establish myself
javiersito12 : [-o<
indondasani : gaston; why would I claim that?
jaydmoore : I'm drawn away from them
javiersito12 : lol
indondasani : you're the one saying it means _states_.
jaydmoore : I need to get back to Arkansas
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:16:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
javiersito12 : amen
esotericx10 : primeval_water i see....so you mean "Bible" Scholar...?
gaston_45 : ah, then you agree, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed means the citizens then
javiersito12 : :^o
indondasani : gaston; no similarity.
indondasani : the other interpretation of the second amendment has some validity.
jaydmoore : you don't agree, trent... I'm not talking about god
gaston_45 : the right of the people is in both correct?
indondasani : you're simply strawmanning it.
practidel : doesn't the supernatural communicate symbolically? & are such symbols present in the mind of the believer initially?
gaston_45 : no, I am not
jaydmoore : I'm talking about sasquatch
primeval_water : Nah, the scholarship is God's, his deliverance from life and salvation
indondasani : the key is "a well-regulated militia".
markextreme73 : why defy truth,God's words are without equal,if you had a tower of gold it still wouldn't be worth what the pages of the bible say
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:17:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: the sasquatch would be cryptozoological, not supernatural.
tony_met2002 : Stan science needs to go by faith and not by knowledge
esotericx10 : primeval_water And tell me what is in Genesis chapter IV that they can't seem to get past...?
gaston_45 : it does not state a well regulated militia has a right to keep and pear arms
random_stan : ur dodging the question
signofthescorpion : Why not markextreme?
try_anything_once1 : you tell em mark
gaston_45 : it says the right of the POEPLE
gaston_45 : people
primeval_water : Nothing
indondasani : because people make up militias.
jaydmoore : the sasquatch would be COMPLETELY unfounded in the scientific community, grem
jaydmoore : and it WOULD apply
random_stan : what about hindu
gaston_45 : so arming the people is the right then indo
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: like the giant squid was?
jaydmoore : if not, randi IS a fraud
practidel : who can fathom the subconscious mind?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:18:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
indondasani : everyone can be part of a militia. but they aren't.
gaston_45 : not arming the militia
gaston_45 : they are indo
markextreme73 : you want a treasure ,easy to find ,look for a bible
indondasani : arming the people FOR militias.
primeval_water : I mean, you know, nothing, the truth of the origin of the universe being sin, the origin of humanity being sin again, nothing
indondasani : really?
sara2smile2 : tertullian is RAY and its much easier to say
gaston_45 : everyone between 18 and 44 in most sttes
gaston_45 : states
gaston_45 : yes
indondasani : what are membership in militia groups nowadays?
jaydmoore : I will bring him forth, grem... and I WILL force "randi" to pay up
cynikal_mind : ray, many works of art went into the foundation of civilization....and I dare say that MANY of them were totally irreligious
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: okay.
gaston_45 : I just listed it indo
jaydmoore : because it is COMPLETELY unevidenced
jaydmoore : and thus "supernatural"
indondasani : last I checked, we had an all-volunteer armed force, and the draft is only 18-25.
candice2027 : i:))
esotericx10 : jaydmoore Actually a research team did go to Nepal and found a hair sample that so far no one has been able to assign to a known species
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:19:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
indondasani : and male.
gaston_45 : look it up, it is in the us codes and also in state codes or constitutions, depending on the state
jaydmoore : I know where he lives
jesus_freak0531 : SHUT UP STAN
tertullian_2002 : in pm
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: you're still not quite getting this.
primeval_water : It's like, "Why can't we all sit here and threaten and insult and annoy God forever, that's our tradition, don't insult it."
sara2smile2 : pm's Ray;)
cynikal_mind : RUN AWAY< RUN AWAY
gaston_45 : millitia is not military
indondasani : and you don't actually _have_ any codes for this onhand?
gaston_45 : two completely different things
jaydmoore : they've also found footprints, eso...
gaston_45 : do you?
markextreme73 : god bless you all
jaydmoore : but it is unfounded by scientific explinations
signofthescorpion : A treasure I have found myself personally is way greater then the telling of storys in a book that people abide by to get some help through life markextreme
jaydmoore : thus, "supernatural"
indondasani : I do now.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:20:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : I get it perfectly, grem
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: okay. When it turns out you're wrong, don't call it a scam.
markextreme73 : sign ,you are just confused at the moment
sara2smile2 : he is gone, I think
jaydmoore : randi's downfall WILL be his dishonesty
cynikal_mind : hey ray, let's go of into pm and stroke one another:x
cynikal_mind : *off
eyezayuh45_7 : Eli, Eli, Lama Sabachtani, y'all.
ginxyz2000 : Actually, the universe is flat shaped and in a constant state of expansion.
practidel : laughs out loud
practidel : hey stan you're one letter short of satan
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:21:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : he CANNOT deny evidence on things that he wants to deny and accept things he wants to accept
signofthescorpion : I am not confused im perfectly clear on my path and prioritys.. in fact quite close to what im doing
gaston_45 : us code chapter 13 indo
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: no. But he can deny that cryptozoological animals are supernatural.
jesus_is_weak : =D>
jaydmoore : I'll draw up records of people trying to prove aliens with crop-circles, for instance
jaydmoore : how is that, grem?
primeval_water : You'd sit there an glean that statement from the life that creation sustains?
try_anything_once1 : can any atheist tell me what kind of proof they need that God exists?
primeval_water : Your life?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: because cryptozoological animals aren't supernatural.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:22:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : are they proven?
eyezayuh45_7 : beings unfathomable by human abilities? Then how are you able to fathom this?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: if they were, then the supernatural would have been proved to occur when A.dux was catalogued.
self_interest_speaks : try_anything_once1, sure, I think I can do that
jaydmoore : now YOU are on the opposite side of the argument
ginxyz2000 : Try:Preferably something empirical, measurable and rationally objective.
jesus_freak0531 : HE DIDNT RUN AWAY YOU ASS
ginxyz2000 : preferably*
jaydmoore : NOTHING is supernatural
cynikal_mind : it is impossible to criticize a position that changes as it goes along....
eyezayuh45_7 : try_anything: How about somebody prays and grows an amputated limb back?
jaydmoore : that is his downfall
indondasani : which US code?
practidel : God's utility is not a being to believed in, but a mental construct to be used creatively
jesus_freak0531 : HEY STAN GET A LIFE
primeval_water : Your idiots, you just come up with anything, out of context, thoughtfully for your own fun
jesus_is_weak : try - how about the christian god doing something godly like moving mountains or something or another flood or something
esotericx10 : jaydmoore the only way that crop circles can be attributed to aliens is if someone actually sees aliens making one and records the event for posterity
jaydmoore : this is where he will pay me 1 million bucks
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:23:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gaston_45 : title 10 chapter 13
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: nothing is supernatural. Good. But that which is not evidenced is not necessarily supernatural.
signofthescorpion : God Bless us all markextreme? Your God has blessed us with Evil and because of his biblical choice that is the reason the world is at it is now
jaydmoore : oh, grem, are you saying now that sasquatch IS evidenced?
practidel : god creates gay people, don't ya know that stan?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:24:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : at the same time are you telling me that aliens are evidence?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: no. I'm saying that the sasquatch isn't considered an supernatural animal.
jaydmoore : evidenced
gremlin_net : a*
jesus_is_weak : Christian experiment: Cut your head off, pray for your god to sew it back on, and then see me about it
jaydmoore : nothing is supernatural, grem
jaydmoore : that is the whole point
eyezayuh45_7 : If Sasquatch is real, it's natural. If it's not real, its a myth. Not supernatural.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: stop being obtuse.
jaydmoore : and I'll call him on it
jaydmoore : I'm no
jaydmoore : not
jaydmoore : that is my plan
primeval_water : Say two people are chatting, and then, a response, so the subject changes. . . no big deal, it's idiocy, just change the subject, say there's no context for participation
jaydmoore : to bring all of this to him
cynikal_mind : time for some anime.....see ya
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:25:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gaston_45 : section 311 indo
jaydmoore : he will be FORCED to admit fradulance
try_anything_once1 : jesus_is _week...is that what it would take? that's what satan wanted too but Jesus the bible says do not tempt the Lord thy God
jesus_is_weak : trent - now you know very well satan is a myth >:)
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: you are. You're suggesting that you're either right about the sasquatch being supernatural, or your right about it being real. You're not getting that it's mythical but not supernatural.
jaydmoore : and he WILL pay me
gremlin_net : you're*
eyezayuh45_7 : Oh, fer chrissakes. There's a Biblical excuse for everything.
eyezayuh45_7 : Now theres a biblical excuse not to provide proof.
signofthescorpion : Hehe The Biblical God is supernateral although The holy Ghost Etc is ok then is it.. Even though Spirits and stuff are forbidden to be messed with.. yeah makes a lot of sense.. no really
jaydmoore : he will be forced to admit fradulance.. and he will pay me
gaston_45 : all citizens 17 to 45, I was off a few years
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:26:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gremlin_net : eyezayuh45_7: that's impressive, since the bible says 'prove all things'.
jaydmoore : it was all an exercise in futility
primeval_water : I can see thte Bible there, sprouting arms and shaking its finger in warning
radardog : Now if big foot could conjure magic.. heheheh
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: okay. Go work on that. don't say I never warned you.
esotericx10 : primeval_water When I asked yo a question you replied "nothing" at that point I lost interest in anything further you had to say
jaydmoore : I won't
indondasani : gaston; would you be referring to the "unofficial militia", I take it?
jaydmoore : no
jesus_is_weak : try - i realize that god cant do anything really... how about praying that you'll win the lottery?
jaydmoore : I will
ginxyz2000 : Look, bringing Sasquatch before Randi would be a bad idea. Any paranormal researcher will tell you that the Bigfoot/Sasquatch issue is NOT in the realm of the supernatural. It exists in the realm of the mythical.
jaydmoore : and you remember it
primeval_water : Don't pick on me then, use ignore
indondasani : given that there is an official US militia.
jesus_freak0531 : SHUT THE FUCK UP TONY
try_anything_once1 : don't look for a mountain to move, just look at one
eyezayuh45_7 : Grem - it sez that, does it? Good, then prove God is all good, not one ounce evil.
practidel : I've always wonder why people ascribe holiness to primitive rituals
jesus_is_weak : trent - now you be a good boy now
jesus_freak0531 : it is
gremlin_net : ginxyz2000: that's what he refuses to accept.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:27:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jesus_freak0531 : im defending him asshole
jaydmoore : grem, do you remember you idea of "suing the churches because of natural disasters"?
gaston_45 : yes indo
colorofjanuary : i've never bee n so drunk in my lgr.
jaydmoore : this is the SAME principal
jesus_freak0531 : he need people like you to fil up hell
gremlin_net : eyezayuh45_7: there's no evidence that any deities have ever existed. Let alone what their dispositions might be.
colorofjanuary : wwow. howly shoit
colorofjanuary : cries
jaydmoore : but I don
jesus_freak0531 : not you jesus asswipe
jaydmoore : don't plan to sue
gaston_45 : there was not an official milita until almost 100 years after the constitution was written
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: yeah; I remember that; it was a joke.
jaydmoore : I plan to win
jesus_freak0531 : i am
jaydmoore : it was a good joke
eyezayuh45_7 : Grem - I think we're on the same side, dude.
jesus_freak0531 : no you people piss me off
jesus_is_weak : try - well something spectacular must happen that breaks all the laws of science for me to believe in some god
gaston_45 : look up the date the national guard was founded
jaydmoore : and this is my plan
practidel : do we have a witness?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:28:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
esotericx10 : I'm not certain that there is a very distinct line between supernatural and mythical
jaydmoore : to sham a shammer
jesus_freak0531 : christians are people to you dumbass we can swear
gaston_45 : when it was written there was only an unorganised militia
just_me_29670 : bender better to be pissed off then pissedon
ginxyz2000 : Grem:Well I'll say it again, myself being something of an amateur paranormal researcher:Sasquatch exists in the realm of myth and folklore, NOT the supernatural.
jaydmoore : there isn't, eso
jaydmoore : there is none at all
colorofjanuary : cannot see and cannot make a sentecne prolerly.
primeval_water : supernatural insects, mythical trees
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: okay. Just don't be surprised when Randi ends up suing you for libel.
jesus_freak0531 : we do
eyezayuh45_7 : eso - mythical = non-existent. supernatural = exists in a different plane than ours.
jaydmoore : LOL
triciabeeblebrox : you should not have the need to swear
colorofjanuary : hi grem.
gremlin_net : ginxyz2000: I know. The sasquatch falls under crytozoology.
gremlin_net : Hi Jan.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:29:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
ginxyz2000 : Oh you better believe there is a line between myths and the supernatural...a very definite one.
colorofjanuary : grem: i'm scared
jesus_freak0531 : we dont have to be nice to you all we have to do is to beleive in jesus the savior and god
ginxyz2000 : Grem:Exactly.
gremlin_net : Jan: of what?
practidel : rancor is a manifestation of Jesus in ethnocentric mindsets
triciabeeblebrox : you guys never are nice
gaston_45 : are you starting to see how that interpretation is flawed indo?
jaydmoore : even the most adament skeptic can't match the wit of someone who has planned things out and KNOWS that he is a fraud
primeval_water : Then there is the Yeti, which dwells in artic areas
eyezayuh45_7 : Bender - can I quote you?
just_me_29670 : candice what is that shiit
ginxyz2000 : Urban mythology, especially, draws the line between myths and the supernatural.
jesus_freak0531 : ok
triciabeeblebrox : this is a revalation
colorofjanuary : grem: never beeen this drunk.
primeval_water : Or what the Pope decries in movies
jesus_freak0531 : you do that you weak minded fool
candice2027 : \:D/
gremlin_net : Jan: ah. That.
jesus_freak0531 : aha
colorofjanuary : grem: never not remembered things.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:30:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jesus_freak0531 : sure
jesus_is_weak : Jesus_freak - we need guys like you in hell!
triciabeeblebrox : what is this song?
esotericx10 : Myths often have some basis in truth...supernatural suggests attributes beyond what is thought to be withing the scope of natural laws
indondasani : gaston; actually...
colorofjanuary : grem: just camef rom a wedding reception, but don't remember it . it's scary.
esotericx10 : ^within
practidel : falls down near candice2027
practidel : followers of benny hinn are pushovers
gaston_45 : awful quite indo
gremlin_net : Jan: you probably aren't missing much.
indondasani : I found a site that goes pretty much through any argument you could bring up and debunks it.
candice2027 : =D>
triciabeeblebrox : good defeniton, esotericx
wicked_red_i_clown666 : is there any atheist people in here?
candice2027 : :))|:D/
indondasani : gaston; been reading.
gaston_45 : which site is this?
eyezayuh45_7 : But natural "laws" or our understanding of them, necessarily expand to encompass what was once thought to be supernatural.
gaston_45 : hci.org?
ginxyz2000 : Take John Henry, for example...a popular urban myth that suggests NOTHING supernatural.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:31:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
colorofjanuary : i'm never drinking this much again in my life. fuck.
jesus_is_weak : Benny Hinn is lying about his real birth name... thats a sin!!!! :-O
radardog : has a Ouija board. Tell me how to prove hell with it.
indondasani : http://www.militia-watchdog.org/
indondasani : actually.
gremlin_net : Jan: I've said that a lot.
triciabeeblebrox : he played classical once
primeval_water : The nuance of friar tuck
try_anything_once1 : why is it that atheists expect christians to be "perfect"when that would NEVER happen while we are still alive on this earth as we are human just like everyone else
colorofjanuary : grem i remember it being fun.............
indondasani : part three seems to deal well with the history of the militia.
gaston_45 : look up the court case us vs. miller indo
jaydmoore : IF I can bring him the body of a sasquatch, he will be FORCED to pay me... if not, there WILL BE a court battle
signofthescorpion : Ougi Boards are not hell.. you meet lots of interesting spirits, if its done correctly
jesus_freak0531 : ok listen stan sorry for going off on you like that its just my whole life i have grown up on christian beleifs and i think that makes me close minded again i am sorry
indondasani : though, I haven't had a chance to look it all up.
radardog : signofthescorpion- Sure they can.
jaydmoore : and it is all dependant on my hunting skills
colorofjanuary : grem: i barely remember getting home.
gremlin_net : try_anything_once1: we don't. In fact, at this point, we pretty well expect christians to be fuckups.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:32:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
primeval_water : Jolly ole' Friar Tuck, god love 'em
jaydmoore : cause I KNOW where the fucker lives
eyezayuh45_7 : Atheist expect nothing of the sort. Atheists aresimply unimpressed with arguments for God.
jesus_is_weak : OUIJA or OUGI?
wicked_red_i_clown666 : are there any christians in here?
colorofjanuary : gream: it's scary.
gaston_45 : lol, that site is put out by hci indo
gaston_45 : you know who they are?
jaydmoore : ouija
eyezayuh45_7 : Are you saying you can't argue well for god because you're imperfect?
esotericx10 : eyezayuh45_7 Which is why I haven't dismissed the possibility of a deital creator entity
radardog : jesus_freak0531- Mine is spelled Ouija.
gremlin_net : Jan: yeah. Eat some bread or something.
entrsnm3 : <---christian
ginxyz2000 : J.D., if you bring hom the body of a Sasquatch, you first have to prove it's a supernatural creature, which it ISN'T
practidel : closed minds cannot grow
ginxyz2000 : him*
try_anything_once1 : you guys are always pointing out the flaws in us
jaydmoore : ginx
indondasani : gaston; I imagine it's a group you don't like.
radardog : You can get these spirit contacting devices at toysRus. Fun for the whole family!
wicked_red_i_clown666 : who agreas thats gods not real??
colorofjanuary : gremlin: thank you. i love you.
jaydmoore : there is no such thing as a "supernatural" creature
jaydmoore : that's the whole point
wicked_red_i_clown666 : press 66
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:33:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : if he doesn't pay... he goes to court
jesus_freak0531 : but i judge others who are not christian and i think that is very close minded and it is something i have grown up with around me
gaston_45 : it is a group founded by sarah brady and the ex head of the cia
try_anything_once1 : 777
indondasani : which doesn't detract from their legitimacy, unfortunately.
signofthescorpion : Yeah, of course until the family realizes whats its messing with
wicked_red_i_clown666 : 666
aggro_femme : *tries to read*
practidel : 11 11 11
eyezayuh45_7 : I agree that when the evidence shows God to exist, we will be forced to incorporate that knowledge into our database.
gaston_45 : it detracts greatly from their credablilty
jesus_is_weak : its OUIJA!
ginxyz2000 : Why would he want to pay you in the first place?
indondasani : what's 'hci' stand for?
eyezayuh45_7 : (But I'll NEVER worship the damn fool!)
ginxyz2000 : You haven't met the criteria for the challenge.
radardog : signofthescorpion- You mean they're messing with a cardboard board, and a plastic eye blass with felt tips?
radardog : blass- glass.
try_anything_once1 : good point trent
gremlin_net : If deities are proved to exist, I'll accept that they exist. I won't worship them, of course.
gaston_45 : handgun control incorporated
candice2027 : sugar daddy o
indondasani : not if their argument is based on historical and legal citation.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:34:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : my point is this, and you guys have demonstrated it perfectly: he can ALWAYS deny that something is supernatural
signofthescorpion : Yeah ok radardog you believe that ok
jesus_freak0531 : ok i see what you are saying but i think that alot of people just need something so badly in there life and so they turn to god
colorofjanuary : thanks grem repeatedaly
jaydmoore : because the VERY TERM is a contradiction
indondasani : which I haven't seen a place where it hasn't been, yet.
triciabeeblebrox : actually it's supposed to be 999, so I've heard, the hebrew was translated incorrectly
eyezayuh45_7 : Why should we worship someone that created evil?
indondasani : though, I haven't had a chance to read much of it.
gaston_45 : check out their site sometime, their stated goal is total illegalization of all guns
jesus_freak0531 : i guess it fills the "gap"
gremlin_net : Jan: you really *are* drunk, aren't you....
indondasani : their FAQ is very comphrehensive.
jesus_is_weak : OUIJA is just a silly board game... dumb CHRISTIANs make it seem like its the devil's tool.... that is so retarded!
jaydmoore : BUT, if I can bring him bigfoot, he will be forced to pay... if not, he will lose in court
colorofjanuary : gremline: more thna i ever have been .
indondasani : gaston; immaterial.
Munkey_Atheist : is away (Away)
colorofjanuary : ever
gremlin_net : Jan: you'll live....
practidel : ronald (6) wilson (6) reagan (6)
ginxyz2000 : Look. J.D., his challenge is this:find something commonly thought of as being supernatural but prove that is actually real and natural...right?
radardog : signofthescorpion- I ask people before to show me through a scientific like test that they contact spirits with it, so far, no luck.
colorofjanuary : gremlin: i'ts creepy.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:35:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
colorofjanuary : gre: you're awesome.
indondasani : the support of their argument is what is at hand.
gaston_45 : it is not, all of their arguements that I have seen have been based upon cooked statistics and flat out lies
primeval_water : all hail crispy legions and its mother scary
signofthescorpion : whatever.. have you ever even tried this board game jesus_is_weak?
jesus_freak0531 : stan were you ever christian?
jesus_is_weak : sign - its so dumb
signofthescorpion : lol
indondasani : strange, all of their sources came with citation.
radardog : signofthescorpion- I could 'try' it as we speak, signofthescorpion.
jesus_is_weak : sign - why would i try some dumb board game
indondasani : not something you would expect from such an organization.
jaydmoore : exactly, ginxy
jesus_freak0531 : really?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:36:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
indondasani : and, I saw no statistics.
gaston_45 : giveme one of the sources they listed
jaydmoore : name ONE scientist that BELIEVES in sasquatch
jaydmoore : you can't do it
gaston_45 : did you check it indo?
practidel : I was too. I have transcended christianity
try_anything_once1 : satan has done his job if you think the OUIJA board is harmless
jesus_is_weak : trent - cuz those stupid games are just stupid games
jaydmoore : because they dont
indondasani : and indeed, the site seemed to support the legality of militias.
entrsnm3 : what is sasquatch
colorofjanuary : high fives gremlin for champagne.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: actually, there are a number of scientists who think it might exist.
ginxyz2000 : Then you'd LOSE, J.D.....Bigfoot/Sasquatch is NOT COMMONLY HELD to be supernatural in any respect.
gremlin_net : entrsnm3: Bigfoot.
practidel : I'm a born again saganite now
jaydmoore : thus, by "randi's" definition it is "SUPERNATURAL"
primeval_water : Intially, there were fourty people, they were proto humans, eight of each species, mongol, negro, caucasoid, white and dark arab. The eighth couple would birth their great great grandparents. Each couple was birthed together, male and female, man and wife. The white arab was tempted by one of their gods and succumbed, chose to sin. . . these dieties were sad serving the protohumans, but when the white arab proto human sinned, it infected the dieities with animals, that's where the angels came from.
rendermaster : Good evening!
indondasani : Mahon, John K, The History of the Militia and the National Guard seemed to have been used a couple times.
aggro_femme : colorofjanuary, are you sure you've ever BEEN drunk?
jaydmoore : nothing is, ginxy
gremlin_net : Hi Render.
colorofjanuary : redner. *hump*
gaston_45 : did you actually check the source? or just say, well, they listed a source so they must be right
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:37:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
rendermaster : hey, grem :)
jesus_freak0531 : but did you ever feel at one time there was a god i mean could you feel it our just know?
esotericx10 : jaydmoore nonetheless research has been and is being conducted regarding Sasquatch
candice2027 : i have been iggiedX-(
rendermaster : hiya, jan :)
rendermaster : humps back
colorofjanuary : aggro: often, but never *this* drunk
ginxyz2000 : Nothing is? Hardly.
entrsnm3 : it wouldn't suprise me if a scientist did believe in bigfoot
jaydmoore : not respected scientists, grem..AND they constitute the minority
primeval_water : exaclty
jesus_is_weak : trent - you'd go crazy if a mickey mouse poster had 666 scribbled on it with crayons.... thats how weak your type is
candice2027 : :-*
self_interest_speaks : is away (Away)
aggro_femme : colorofjanuary, you're typing well.
colorofjanuary : does not remmember the past hour
signofthescorpion : All I can say on the ouija thing is.. don't say things about things until you know things
candice2027 : Ray
aggro_femme : *might if she tried*
rendermaster : ray! LTNS!
colorofjanuary : aggr: concentrating. if i stopped paying attention.....
indondasani : gaston; look. if they're going to lie, they'd do it in a way that wouldn't get them caught by anyone who goes to a library.
jesus_freak0531 : when im in church i feel like im being overwhelmed by an invisible power and i think that is God
tertullian_2002 : :D candice...YO RENDER
colorofjanuary : left her purse at t he reception
aggro_femme : colorofjanuary, *nod*
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:38:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
candice2027 : EVERYBODY LOVES RAYMOND
tertullian_2002 : WASSUP DUDED
indondasani : if you're going to cast doubt on them as a source, make the doubt seem reasonable.
primeval_water : Damned tithing
radardog : signofthescorpion- What things?
tertullian_2002 : dud
colorofjanuary : cires
gaston_45 : you would think so but no, not in their case, they rely on people not checking
jaydmoore : the goddamned host of the "skeptical review" veheminantly denies their existance
rendermaster : freak, did you ever think it was just a priest sticking his hand down your pants? ;)
tertullian_2002 : lol
colorofjanuary : AAAAAAAACK
gaston_45 : I can give you an example
practidel : socioeconomic factors have a much greater influence on individual behavior than Jesus in his church
colorofjanuary : snifffles
jaydmoore : they are mythological.. mythological = supernatural
bigg_daddy_jacob : were u catholic
jesus_is_weak : trent - and its all a movie which is all make-believe too
tertullian_2002 : candice: at work?
gaston_45 : you hear about all of the kids dying by guns right?
indondasani : gaston; um...
colorofjanuary : *sigh*
radardog : The devil has corrupted toysrus. Oh dear.
jaydmoore : it's the closest thing to "supernatural" that you can have
indondasani : it also seems that the ADL is in charge of the site.
jesus_freak0531 : and you didnt like
jesus_freak0531 : it
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:39:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: mythological does not mean supernatural. That's what you don't understand yet.
indondasani : not the organization which you mentioned.
colorofjanuary : humps grem
rendermaster : oh, my, tony - I didn't realize you had both barrels shot at you ;)
gaston_45 : usually around a few thousand depending on the year they site
candice2027 : :O
ginxyz2000 : So you'd lose the challenge, J.D....Randi would just say "Ok you've proven that Sasquatch exists and is real. I asked you to prove something supernatural is nothing of the kind but an actual function of the natural realm."
primeval_water : It's good to see spoiled white people argue with poor blacks over what color God is.
try_anything_once1 : hey tony , the longest distance in the world is between your head and your heart
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : :(
jaydmoore : oh.. is "god" not supernatural, grem?
candice2027 : groova murder
primeval_water : Or rich blacks argue with poor whites over which one of them is God.
aggro_femme : I need to move.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: tigers are cats. Cats aren't tigers. Get it?
tertullian_2002 : rocks out
gaston_45 : did you know they count anyone 24 and under as a child indo?
bigg_daddy_jacob : and what exactly do u worship
rendermaster : candice, disco died in the '70s
rendermaster : let it stay dead
tertullian_2002 : lol render
jesus_freak0531 : do you beleive in any higher power
indondasani : yup, they're a part of the Anti-Defamation League.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:40:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : that is my point from the VERY BEGINING, ginxy
candice2027 : :)
jaydmoore : you should learn the argument before you step in
indondasani : gaston; the ADL?
jesus_freak0531 : ok
primeval_water : Or the white arabs and dark arabs mix it up with mongols over which one of them "Comes from beyond."
jaydmoore : you don't get it, grem
jaydmoore : is god supernatural
candice2027 : i will not interrupt Tony only dance inbetween talk sessions!
jaydmoore : according to you?
bigg_daddy_jacob : well what do u suppose we do when we die
practidel : 11 dimensions in string theory (10 spatial)
jesus_freak0531 : do you live in the East Coast Tony?
jaydmoore : is the biblical account of god "supernatural?
bigg_daddy_jacob : disappear
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: deities would be supernatural.
rendermaster : candice, there are wonderful new machines that each and every one of us have access to: they are called "STEREOS"; amazingly, if we wish to listen to music, we can simply turn our stereo on...
jaydmoore : exactly
primeval_water : This we thing, take it, don't leave it.
jesus_freak0531 : i could tell by your accent
jesus_freak0531 : where
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:41:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
indondasani : or the organization which you claim these people are affiliated with>?
jesus_freak0531 : i am from New Jersey
ginxyz2000 : THAT'S your arguement??? You're going to get a Sasquatch and prove that there really is no such things as anything "supernatural"?????
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: the supernatural would be mythical. The mythical would not necessarily be supernatural.
jaydmoore : are deities "mythological"?
jesus_freak0531 : where in Pennsylvania
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : Candice, why don't you go to a club... what, NO Boyfriend???
jaydmoore : that's such a load of bullshit, gremlin
tertullian_2002 : hey michelle
jaydmoore : and you know it
gaston_45 : the anti gun organisations indo
jesus_freak0531 : New Brunswick
try_anything_once1 : could any atheist tell me what's going to happen to them when they die
michelle83201 : hi Ray
rendermaster : trent, einstein didn't say anything about life after death; that's a bit of your own addition
indondasani : has never heard of "ymlite". as a client.
michelle83201 : try, we're going to be in the ground, probably
tertullian_2002 : lets party
practidel : candice, would you like to dance on cam?
primeval_water : Really now
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: then stop speaking English. Because, according to English, it's not bullshit. It's how things work.
candice2027 : |:d/
esotericx10 : jaydmoore It is not BS and I concur with Gremlin
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:42:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : LOL
candice2027 : ok practidel
primeval_water : I turn the pc off
triciabeeblebrox : she could go to a club, to find a date maybe
jesus_freak0531 : yeah i live in Washington state now
rendermaster : well, if you saw it in a movie, it must be true
deadman_932 : lil missy:x
practidel : faints
jaydmoore : give me one example
indondasani : gaston; where's the documentation for such an interesting claim?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: of what?
rendermaster : try books, trent
jesus_freak0531 : im moving back to the East Coast though
amazing_live_sea_monkey : Energy is not synonymous with life. You might as well argue that a Duracell battery is alive.
jaydmoore : tell my WHY bigfoot can be "mythological" but not "supernatural"
michelle83201 : why are you moving, bender?
jesus_freak0531 : yeah
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : The West is the best
ginxyz2000 : J.D., if that's your idea, it's a silly one...all you'd be doing is evidencing the non-supernatural nature of something that isn't thought to be supernatural in the first place.
jaydmoore : and I don't want your word, grem
indondasani : is ymlite related to YahELite?
jaydmoore : I don't trust it
jesus_freak0531 : just started snowing yesterday
gaston_45 : they use the cdc figures but they include figures for anyone under 24 as a child
jaydmoore : give me something with foundation
michelle83201 : because big foot doesn't have special powers?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: because bigfoot would be cryptozoological, which is mythical, but not supernatural.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:43:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
rendermaster : trent, the original japanese movie is much better, but only if you don't mind reading subtitles
jesus_freak0531 : yeah its always warm in the East
triciabeeblebrox : have you seen the japensese version trent?
irrefragabilis : michelle
deadman_932 : hey, bigfoot be havin ' mad powers of majik
michelle83201 : <--has whitening things on her teeth
aggro_femme : *idles*
rendermaster : tricia :)
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : the japanese version is on Kazaa
jaydmoore : give me the definition of cryptozoological, grem... I said I don't want your word
signofthescorpion : Called Ringu
ginxyz2000 : Because the Bigfoot/Sasquatch does NOT exist beyond the boundaries of the natural world in any form or function.
jaydmoore : give me some foundation
esotericx10 : jaydmoore At one time great apes were thought to be mythical...it turns out they were not..nor were they supernatural....nor were they EVER thought to be supernatural
gremlin_net : Fuck....
triciabeeblebrox : rangu, i think it's called
jesus_freak0531 : yeah and i am going to college at NYU
indondasani : gaston; I still have no more than your word that this site is in any way affiliated with the group you claimed it is.
aggro_femme : *waves to deadman first*
triciabeeblebrox : hey render
deadman_932 : llyn:X
deadman_932 : hi gorgeous
signofthescorpion : Just "Ringu".. seen it in kazaa also
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:44:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
rendermaster : is familiar with NYU rather intimately
triciabeeblebrox : you have to read subtiltes, but it seemed a little bit better
jaydmoore : exactly, eso
gremlin_net : Cryptozoology is the study of mythical animals. Those animals asserted to exist without actual evidence of them.
rendermaster : "ringu"
ginxyz2000 : Howdy Deadster.
gaston_45 : i am finding the board of directors right now
jaydmoore : but that is NOT the point
aggro_femme : *winks*
triciabeeblebrox : fear.com, should have bean called bore.com
deadman_932 : hey el senor jefe ginxmeister
bigg_daddy_jacob : what does that have to do with anything
radardog : Is the Jersey Devil considered a mythical animal?
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : Tony, you sound as though you are bald... is that so?
jesus_freak0531 : so you been to Port Jervis New York?
rendermaster : I agree, tricia - that movie was a waste of 90 minutes
practidel : cat stevens used to be cool before he became a muslim
deadman_932 : hiya tricia
triciabeeblebrox : I have only seen it once, on video, render, with my mother talking through it.
deadman_932 : and hi jd
jaydmoore : oh, grem.. I see. you can use a LITERAL definition of "supernatural" when it suits your needs?
triciabeeblebrox : I think it's worth renting though
ginxyz2000 : I'm a "Jefe"???? Sweeeeet!
deadman_932 : and hi ALL of you
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : Candice is 28 years old, yet she speaks and acts like a child
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:45:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
esotericx10 : jaydmoore JD that is the point ...something CAB be mythical without being supernatural
jaydmoore : what did you say that randi said "supernatural" was again?
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : No wonder she can't get a date
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: stop strawmanning me.
esotericx10 : *CAN
rendermaster : which one, tricia? the ring or fear.com?
candice2027 : :)suck on my big toe
michelle83201 : ah, be nice to Candice
irrefragabilis : candice gets lots of cock
jaydmoore : I think that mythological would fit inside of "supernatural".. but that's just me
deadman_932 : cat stevens has a stuffed bigfoot in his seraglio
tertullian_2002 : :p
rendermaster : "nice" doesn't exist in this chat room :)
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: you're right--that's just you.
michelle83201 : <--doesn't have sound on
michelle83201 : tell me about it, render
jaydmoore : LOL
indondasani : yawns.
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : sell your tricks somewhere else Candice
radardog : Grem, esoteric, where would you guys place the 'Jeresy Devil'?
rendermaster : those with thin skins and a rather limited education won't be too happy around here ;)
ginxyz2000 : Try and prove ectoplasm is not supernatural, J.D....that'll be a step in the right direction.
practidel : smiles happily at candice2027
indondasani : render; "Nice" doesn't exist. It's a myth.
triciabeeblebrox : ringu, I'd rent that one.
jaydmoore : hey, dead
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:46:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
practidel : :p
rendermaster : no, indon, it's more supernatural
indondasani : I'd like to see some evidence for it right now!
indondasani : you have three seconds!
rendermaster : ;)
indondasani : threetwoone IGNORED!
triciabeeblebrox : maybe even the ring, as well, it was not totally boring, but fear.com put me to sleep
jesus_freak0531 : so tony ever been to Bushkill PA
indondasani : chuckles.
candice2027 : trick or treat
gremlin_net : radardog: the Jersey Devil is filed under Things I've Never Heard of. What is it?
tertullian_2002 : grabs candice2027 and dances around the room
deadman_932 : jersey devil was more like mass hysteria...so..i pick "myth"
jaydmoore : exactly, grem.. randi will have to admit fraudulance on his wording of "supernatural"... if not, he WILL compensate me for my efforts wasted
candice2027 : faints on Ray
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: okay.
jesus_freak0531 : its way up north
tertullian_2002 : ;)
rendermaster : the amazing randi!
michelle83201 : candice, are you in school?
deadman_932 : grem: hoofprints around jersey, allegedly
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:47:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
esotericx10 : radardog I've heard of the Jersey Devil but I am not familiar with it
rendermaster : is he still alive?
jaydmoore : and he WILL NOT get copyrights on the discovery
candice2027 : :-*RAY you Cali baby:x
rendermaster : nite, trent
michelle83201 : candice, will you date my husband?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: that's nice. Is bigfoot going to be the judge in this case you're winning?
jesus_freak0531 : did you go to college in NY
jesus_freak0531 : PA
tertullian_2002 : candice you flirt
jesus_freak0531 : sorry
michelle83201 : I'm tired of him--take him off my back
tertullian_2002 : lol michelle
jaydmoore : the court of law will be, grem
jesus_freak0531 : how old are you?
triciabeeblebrox : you can self study tony
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: then you'll lose.
michelle83201 : I think Candice and my husband would be perfect together
candice2027 : I love you Ray;;)
triciabeeblebrox : looks like you have
jaydmoore : not quite
radardog : gremlin_net- I suppose this site gives a better description than I could:
radardog : http://theshadowlands.net/jd.htm
tertullian_2002 : candice you love everybody
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:48:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : LOl, Candice is so Easy...
tertullian_2002 : :)
indondasani : lived for almost a decade in new jersey, and didn't learn anything about it until after he moved to texas and saw an X-files episode about it.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: yes quite. You can't win a case based on 'I refused to understand what I was suing about'.
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : Its not real passion, when you bed a nympho... lol
rendermaster : ahh - so that's what it means when someone says jesus loves everyone! he just wanted to have sex with all of mankind! ;)
ginxyz2000 : J.D., if you pull this off and end up going to court over it, you are SO gonna lose.
tertullian_2002 : lol render
candice2027 : :O
tertullian_2002 : ;)
jesus_freak0531 : i lost my east coast accent being here in WA but i can always tell when someone is from there
michelle83201 : right, candice?
jaydmoore : he can lose a case based on... "i deliberately worded my challenge fraudulantly", grem
signofthescorpion : Ill be going.. GoodNight All
gremlin_net : radardog: this thing would probably be cryptozoological.
rendermaster : nite, sign
indondasani : radar; by the way, the Bacon story was most interesting (even though I'm going to finish reading it later).
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:49:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
indondasani : even reading only the first half, I can tell it's good.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: you haven't even read through the wording yet. You already conceded that much.
radardog : gremlin_net- That would make sense, but its description and reported birth would defy known nature.
jesus_freak0531 : well goodnight tony
jaydmoore : you cannot say that something is supernatural without excepting mythological creatures!!! .... LOL
esotericx10 : radardog the article refers to it as both mythical and supernatural
jesus_freak0531 : bye
jaydmoore : if you do, you are a fraud
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : Lol, yesterdays rave music, tomorrow's crap Candice
gremlin_net : radardog: yeah. Maybe.
rendermaster : well, this is a first - I've never come into the chat room to find a discussion of bigfoot before
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:50:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
candice2027 : i have to dance around the room naked and jump on the bed now. bye kiddies
irrefragabilis : render it's all your fault
indondasani : render; damn, you don't chat enough.
irrefragabilis : everyone knows bigfoot is a Jewish myth
rendermaster : lol
manestardust : :O
rendermaster : rofl
michelle83201 : jewish?
deadman_932 : has bigfeet . does that count
irrefragabilis : zoe
practidel : can I see candice?
irrefragabilis : hehe
manestardust : hola
aggro_femme : *wishes Hunter were awake*
indondasani : bed is sounding good right about now.
ginxyz2000 : Does Randi assert that Sasquatch IS a supernatual creature?
rendermaster : whose bed, indon?
gremlin_net : Bigfoot isn't a jewish myth. That's Bignose you're thinking of >:)
michelle83201 : so Candice, are you going to date my husband, or what?
indondasani : ah, candices', but barring that, my own.
self_interest_speaks : is back
self_interest_speaks : Stretches
gremlin_net : ginxyz2000: nope.
jaydmoore : deadman, the question is: would "bigfoot" win the "randi test"
rendermaster : so far, the sasquatch/bigfoot/yeti is still a folk tale
jaydmoore : I think it would
indondasani : candice's, rather.
trentonator : big foot owes me 5 bucks
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:51:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
deadman_932 : hmmmm...
michelle83201 : I'm not listening to voice, btw, candice, because he's in here
tertullian_2002 : :))
triciabeeblebrox : for some reason, I don't see hodiboba, on the room list
radardog : Bigfoot is an easy example, such a beast could easily be described within nature. The same with Nessy. But some of these others.. lol
wiccediva : lol trent
jaydmoore : if not, randi is in risk of SERIOUS legal pursuits
deadman_932 : wow that's kinda tough...i'd have to look at the exact wording
irrefragabilis : trenton
trentonator : dusty
practidel : sings a song for candice2027
rendermaster : is going to call my cousin who runs the bank that holds the mortgage to grem's hovel and have him foreclose ;)
tertullian_2002 : wb dusty
jaydmoore : exactly, dead... and from what I HAVE heard... it would
gremlin_net : radardog: Nessie is a slightly different story. There's evidence that something large and unknown is in LochNess. We just don't know what it is yet.
indondasani : hmm. the guy I was debating on gun policy left.
deadman_932 : but randi's was for supernatural, huh?
jaydmoore : the wording I HAVE heard is... "supernatural"
indondasani : maybe he got tired.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:52:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : supernatural is impossible
jaydmoore : so
deadman_932 : lemme look at randi's site and see what he's got there
irrefragabilis : ray
aggro_femme : Is that a jewish joke?
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : Trent, I thought you were seven years old
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : lol
tertullian_2002 : :D
triciabeeblebrox : teenwolf was stupid
irrefragabilis : i suck cock really well
gremlin_net : deadman_932: http://randi.org
jaydmoore : you have to go with... what is unfounded by science
irrefragabilis : apparently
tertullian_2002 : yeah?
deadman_932 : gropes llyna before he leaves...brb.
irrefragabilis : haha
jaydmoore : sasquatch is that
irrefragabilis : ROFL
irrefragabilis : candice!
rendermaster : well, dusty, you should always be proud of your talents
jaydmoore : unfounded
manestardust : :O
radardog : Grem- In either case, it being there or not there, the description is something that we can assume wouldn't be beyond nature.
irrefragabilis : render, it's a new thing i started doing a few weeks ago
gremlin_net : radardog: probably not.
irrefragabilis : i'm catching on quick
indondasani : render; could you call up your jewish uncle who dictates who wins the Texas Lottery and get next week's numbers for me?
rendermaster : lol
aggro_femme : *gets goped*
aggro_femme : groped*
scotsmanmatt : Hello al
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:53:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
candice2027 : :))
scotsmanmatt : and everyone else
indondasani : hey, scots.
scotsmanmatt : :P
trentonator : oral sex is great dusty
kierkegaardian_knight_of_faith : Pimps out Candice for two bucks a person
ginxyz2000 : Not understood does NOT equal unfouded
tertullian_2002 : lol
trentonator : you know it's my fav
rendermaster : sure, indon - right after he speaks with president bush to tell him what needs to be done for the next week
gremlin_net : radardog: the difference is that bigfoot has been described as a certain type of animal. Nessie is known to be a certain mass, but we have no idea whether it's a fish or a reptile or what.
candice2027 : :o)
jaydmoore : thinks it's funny that gremlin COMPLETELY changed his argument
jaydmoore : but he did it subtely
indondasani : scots; you check Craig's site lately for anything in response to the thing I sent?
candice2027 : brb
indondasani : hasn't gotten a response in his email.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: I never changed anything. You just started believing your strawman.
michelle83201 : Is it strange that I never want to have sex with my husband again?
indondasani : isn't sure it even got to Craig.
rendermaster : depends, michelle - I've never seen your husband
jaydmoore : no, grem
michelle83201 : render, he's hot, but so what?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:54:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
irrefragabilis : michelle, i dont blame you
irrefragabilis : i'm all for polygamy
michelle83201 : he is so damn boring too
tertullian_2002 : lol michelle, wh?
tertullian_2002 : why?
deadman_932 : umm..the way it's worded ...and knowing randi's writings...shit..you know what, why don't we ask him in an e-mail?
scotsmanmatt : Indon: no...I agreed not to use the KCA until or unless the issue you raised was resolved
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: show me where I ever suggested that cryptozoological animals were supernatural.
irrefragabilis : we had that conversation already
michelle83201 : is irregragabilis dusty?
irrefragabilis : yes michelle
jaydmoore : at first you concluded that "supernatural isn't possible"... then you said that "bigfoot doesn't fit the supernatural mold"
indondasani : scots; ah, ok. I'll have to check sometime soon.
tertullian_2002 : yes
michelle83201 : oh, hey dusty, lol
rendermaster : you have a "hot" husband, but he's boring outside of the bedroom?
indondasani : when I'm not so sleepy.
irrefragabilis : ;)
radardog : Grem- Last I heard they sonar'd the entire lake and didn't find anything.
jaydmoore : of course they don't, grem
michelle83201 : yes, render
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: those aren't contradictions.
jaydmoore : but that isn't the point
indondasani : but, in the meantime, I am indeed sleeping.
jaydmoore : as you admitted
indondasani : g'night, all!
michelle83201 : I actually tried to talk to him tonight, a rare thing,
michelle83201 : and he's just reading some stupid book
rendermaster : nite,indon
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:55:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
michelle83201 : some fantasy book--at least he could read something interesting
irrefragabilis : book about what?
jaydmoore : and as I said originally... "randi can write ANYTHING off as 'non-supernatural'"
deadman_932 : we can ask in an e-mail , or i could ask mike shermer what he thinks
radardog : heheh.. sounds like Hume.
ginxyz2000 : brb
jaydmoore : thanks for reinforcing my statement, grem
michelle83201 : my internet love is at a Marine drill weekend
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: Randi could write anything off as being a plaid mushroom. That's immaterial.
michelle83201 : lol
jaydmoore : LOL
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:56:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
irrefragabilis : michelle you have an internet love??
jaydmoore : grasp some more, grem
irrefragabilis : you slut
michelle83201 : lol--what can I say?
deadman_932 : " At JREF, we offer a one-million-dollar prize to anyone who can show, under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event."
rendermaster : how many marines does he get to drill over the average weekend, michelle? ;)
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: what matters is that there's no evidence of anything supernatural. And that cryptozoological animals wouldn't be considered to be supernatural.
irrefragabilis : render :O
michelle83201 : ewwww, render
practidel : need a stand-in, michelle?
irrefragabilis : chokes
alkaiinebase : 1 million dollars?????
deadman_932 : hmm...i dunno about that one.
jaydmoore : that's a ridiculous statement, grem
michelle83201 : lol practidel--only if you want him to kill you, maybe
scotsmanmatt : Which is a pretty absurd challenge
alkaiinebase : before of after taxes?
scotsmanmatt : at least in respect to Christianit
deadman_932 : yeah, scots, sure
tertullian_2002 : michelle did you move yet?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: how so? Both statements are true. They're able to coexist....
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:57:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
michelle83201 : no, not yet, Ray
jaydmoore : NOTHING CAN be considered supernatural, grem... by your OWN words
jaydmoore : JUST NOW
tertullian_2002 : good call
tertullian_2002 : :)
triciabeeblebrox : what book is he reading michelle
rendermaster : how about SUPRAnatural?
scotsmanmatt : Indeed in respect to Christianity it's a meaningless challenge since God isn't at the beck and call of sceptics to perform his work amongst believers
michelle83201 : Ray, did I tell you I got awarded a $48,000 scholarship from St. Louis?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: I never said that nothing could be considered supernatural. I said that nothing considered to be supernatural was backed by evidence.
zombiefreak6sic6 : life suxs
tertullian_2002 : bravo
michelle83201 : tricia, oh, I don't know
jaydmoore : which is my original point, grem
deadman_932 : scots, get your little xian head out of your ass...it's mainly concerned with psychic shit
michelle83201 : I don't want to ask him, lol
tertullian_2002 : lol
scotsmanmatt : <-- dismissing Randi's challenge as irrelevant to Christianity
tertullian_2002 : all of that huh?
michelle83201 : Ray, are you talking to me?
jaydmoore : would you like me to scroll up and find your lie, grem?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:58:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
scotsmanmatt : deadman: eh...that's not what your citation from JREF indicated
triciabeeblebrox : why not? find out what is holding his interest
rendermaster : what did randi claim about xianity?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: yeah. Do that.
tertullian_2002 : damn that's a lot of money
deadman_932 : good thing your fucking opinion is worthless scots
deadman_932 : just like your ethics
michelle83201 : well, god, their tuition is $26,000 next year
michelle83201 : I don't know if I'll go there--it's certainly not my top choice
tertullian_2002 : scholarship?'
lydia2nv : what's up peeps
deadman_932 : we weren't talking about your god anyway
rendermaster : $26,000 a year for undergraduate?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 00:59:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
michelle83201 : They gave me admissions and the scholarship over the weekend, Ray
tertullian_2002 : law school
michelle83201 : no, law, render
scotsmanmatt : render: see if you can follow this: 1. Randi's challenge is for any supernatural event to be demonstrated. 2. In Christianity supernatural occurrences are reported. 3. Hence Christianity is included in Randi's challenge.
triciabeeblebrox : lack of common interests, a lot of people seem to get divorced, with that as a cause
michelle83201 : I applied a couple Fridays ago, and they sent the letter on Monday--that's a little scsry, if you ask me
michelle83201 : scary*
triciabeeblebrox : how old are you michelle?
michelle83201 : 26
triciabeeblebrox : cool
michelle83201 : lol--I feel old now
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:00:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
tertullian_2002 : lol you are
tertullian_2002 : :P
triciabeeblebrox : so they don't hand out scholarships to just the kiddies
jaydmoore : gremlin_net : jaydmoore: nothing is supernatural. Good. But that which is not evidenced is not necessarily supernatural.
michelle83201 : I know--I felt much, much yunger at 25
jaydmoore : nothing is supernatural... god
jaydmoore : good
tertullian_2002 : ha
michelle83201 : well, most schools have an average incoming student age of 24-26
triciabeeblebrox : I am 28, and going back to school, my nursing degree does not count for much in the way of getting a traditional bachelors
jaydmoore : I couldn't go back far enough to find direct wording, but I think you can see what you said
rendermaster : I wish I could say that I received more scholarship money than I had to take out in loans when I went to law school, but such was not the case :)
jaydmoore : you KNOW you are being dishonest
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: nothing is supernatural, evidently. Read for context.
radardog : ... As soon as a supernatural event reveals itself in a natural way.. it has lost its status by its very definition.
jaydmoore : LOL
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:01:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
michelle83201 : render, I thought you were like 20
triciabeeblebrox : fuck, I am the only one potty trained in my math class
rendermaster : nope, I'm like 28
michelle83201 : lol tricia
rendermaster : ;)
lydia2nv : any guys with a cam?
deicide666_2000 : yes
scotsmanmatt : radar: eh? so if a chair floats from point A - Z that is not a supernatural event?
jaydmoore : I said "nothing is supernatural".. you said, "nothing is supernatural. good"
spokanetown : so is it possible for man to create a supernaturual event?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:02:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
digital_rose_princess : wow, what lively conversation 8-|
jaydmoore : intellectual dishonesty from grem... couldn't have expected it
michelle83201 : so render, are you done with school now?
deadman_932 : hau, bearshield
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: evidently, nothing considered to be supernatural, at this point of time, actually exists.
BEARSHIELD99 : hau , deadman
rendermaster : yes, michelle
michelle83201 : <--gets to take off the whitening trays in 15 minutes
jaydmoore : now you are rewording your statements, grem
ginxyz2000 : is back
jaydmoore : nothing "considered"
michelle83201 : what do you do now?
jaydmoore : bullshit
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: fine. Believe whatever strawman you like. Then take it to court and go to prison for contempt. If you want to play that game, you can't be saved. I tried.
jaydmoore : LOL
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:03:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
spokanetown : lol
rendermaster : I manage and teach at a computer center at a large NYC private university
ginxyz2000 : and in reading through what is posted on Randi's site, producing a Sasquatch would not meet the requirements of what he is looking for,
jaydmoore : thanks for playing, grem
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: get back to me once you've won your mythical suit against Randi for allowing you to misunderstand a website.
michelle83201 : so you're not in law?
deadman_932 : shit, why not just e-mail the guy and ask?
rendermaster : no, not at present
jaydmoore : that won't be for another 2-3 years, grem
michelle83201 : I see
jaydmoore : I wouldn't expect you to be sore for that long
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:04:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
lydia2nv : Well, I have to go to work now
michelle83201 : by lydia
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: noted. We won't be hearing any more of this bullshit from you before 2006.
ginxyz2000 : This is what Randi will pay a million bucks for:to any person who can demonstrate any psychic, supernatural or paranormal ability under satisfactory observing conditions
jaydmoore : but I guess I can't put it past you, considering this shit
deadman_932 : randi's a pretty damn honorable guy from what i know and i've met him twice now
jaydmoore : LOL
gremlin_net : ginxyz2000: yup. Pretty clear, isn't it?
esotericx10 : is away (Away)
ginxyz2000 : VERY clear. Note the word "ability".
jaydmoore : you've MET him, dead?
deadman_932 : he smacked the shit out of some guy here at caltech and risked arrest
BEARSHIELD99 : what's with Randi?
jaydmoore : well, shit, grem
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:05:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : you didn't tell me that
deadman_932 : yeah, jd...i go to the skeptics meetings here
scotsmanmatt : Randi did a good book called, 'The Faith Healers'
ginxyz2000 : Not artifact or animal or creature..."ability"
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: just noticed you made a huge fucking mistake?
michelle83201 : does anyone want to hear where I applied for law school?
rendermaster : well, if something can be demonstrated, then it's not supernatural, so I guess randi gets to keep his cash ;)
jaydmoore : oh... so aliens don't apply either?
ginxyz2000 : Of course not.
self_interest_speaks : is away (Away)
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: it's not my job to tell you anything. You're the one suing a guy for something on a website you'd never even read.
scotsmanmatt : render: I don't see how that follows
jaydmoore : well shit, I guess I was mistaken
deadman_932 : umm... like i said, it mostly applies to psychic shit
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:06:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
ginxyz2000 : There's nothing commonly held to be supernatural about aliens.
jaydmoore : I've never read it grem... I stated that before now
gremlin_net : Aliens would technically be cryptozoological too.
scotsmanmatt : render: if God made a river to part in the presence of Randi then how would that not be a demonstrated supernatural event
deadman_932 : dowsing, psi crap...blah, blah blah
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: I know. You conceded that you'd never read it, but asserted that it was a hoax.
jaydmoore : I just said: "from what i've heard"
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:07:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : I'm sorry for wasting your time
scotsmanmatt : render: or if spiritualists were able to manifest ectoplasm under randi's conditions then why wouldn't that be the same?
jaydmoore : LOL
BEARSHIELD99 : I would like to see Randi debunk a yuwipi ceremony though
jaydmoore : it was funny though
BEARSHIELD99 : lol
rendermaster : once something is possible, then how is it supernatural any longer?
ginxyz2000 : That's why the word "ability" is used. Aliens, Bigfoot...these things can have a rational explanation and are not connected, by anyone, with beig supernatural.
scotsmanmatt : render: it isn't possible....just being demonstrated
michelle83201 : but doesn't bigfoot live forever?
rendermaster : it is possible, if it's done
michelle83201 : that's pretty supernatural
radardog : michelle83201- It could breed.
scotsmanmatt : render: not possible naturally
gremlin_net : Render: the idea of the contest is to show that something considered to be supernatural actually occurs in reality. It's not to change physics to allow for the supernatural, but to show that these are natural and real events.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:08:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
michelle83201 : but isn't part of the myth that there's one bigfoot?
jaydmoore : I didn't understand his explination of "supernatural" Michelle
BEARSHIELD99 : michelle....."bigfoot" , if it exists , is likely a population of animals
rendermaster : depends on how you define "supernatural"
jaydmoore : it does, render
jaydmoore : and that was my whole argument
ginxyz2000 : Umm...nobody knows the length of a "Bigfoot's" life, so you can't just say they live forever
jaydmoore : I should have read his website
phosphorescentdesertbutt0ns : so whats on the debate tonite?
michelle83201 : <--doesn't think "bigfoot" exists, in the singular or plural
rendermaster : being CONSIDERED supernatural and something actually BEING supernatural are two different matters
scotsmanmatt : supernatural - against the natural order of things?
gremlin_net : Render: if ESP were shown to occur, it would no longer be supernatural. The contest is to show ESP [for example] to occur within nature.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:09:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : nothing IS supernatural, render
radardog : Scots, to follow Hume, if it is possible, and it defies what we know about nature, we were wrong about nature, and it needs to be redefined. Basically, so long as it is shown, we go back to the drawing books to explain it as natural.
jaydmoore : THAT is impossible
deadman_932 : hmmm..interesting point...beyond the natural or antithetic to the known natural?
ginxyz2000 : The one big problem is that in the rules for his challenge, Randi doesn't define supernatural.
deadman_932 : bleh
rendermaster : yes, jay, since if it was possible, then it wouldn't be classified as supernatural in the first place
gremlin_net : ginxyz2000: he doesn't have to. He has examples.
rendermaster : :)
deadman_932 : i hate semantic shit.... teleport yourself and he'll give you a million
rendermaster : lol
scotsmanmatt : radar: then he's doing nothing but setting up a scenario where nothing can be classed as supernatural
gremlin_net : deadman_932: yup.
jaydmoore : exactly, dead
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:10:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : that is why I dismissed it as a "hoax", if you will
ginxyz2000 : Grem:Oh sure there is that...I just think it'd go alot farther for him to give a precise defintion
jaydmoore : my word was "fraud"
jaydmoore : or "sham"
rendermaster : for example, 1000 years ago it would have been though that the ability to send a man to the moon in a round metal tube would most assuredly be "supernatural"
rendermaster : today we konw differently
gremlin_net : ginxyz2000: legally, it makes no difference.
peachlet420 : we know differently from what render?
jaydmoore : it is a semantic contract
jaydmoore : a contract built on a sterotype
rendermaster : so that which is considered supernatural may not actually BE supernatural
peachlet420 : what is j.d?
ginxyz2000 : Grem:No, not legally...just to us who make all this hoopla over it...lol
gremlin_net : Render: right. And if I'd said that I could do that, and then proved it, I'd get a million bucks, in this scenario.
jaydmoore : and THAT is my problem
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:11:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
radardog : Scots- Of course, it assumes an entirely natural world. ;) Which is a valid assumption, and such instances of 'miracles' (the supernatural) are still explained within it.
peachlet420 : what scenerio gremlin?
jaydmoore : the "james randi" test, peaches
rendermaster : ye,s grem, and once you did it, it would no longer be supernatural
gremlin_net : peachlet420: long story.
scotsmanmatt : radar: a valid assumption for who?
peachlet420 : otay
peachlet420 : stretches
peachlet420 : is amonia really a poison
alkaiinebase : is away (Away)
gremlin_net : Render: granted. But it would have *been* supernatural, and proved now to be natural; that's the essence of the contest.
ondoher1 : hello, hello
peachlet420 : ONDO!!!!!!!!!!!
rendermaster : it would have to have been CONSIDERED supernatural
ondoher1 : peachlet
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:12:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
ginxyz2000 : Render:It's like this...if I was to prove that apparitions are not supernatural but a part of the natural function of nature, I'd win.
peachlet420 : I'm so proud of myself
ondoher1 : why?
jaydmoore : if the "supernatural" becomes evidenced, it no longer is "supernatural"... that word should have never been used
peachlet420 : I actually carried on a "meaningful" discussion today
radardog : Scots- Those who wish to hold it. I'm just saying, in general, it's valid and accounts for everything. It being true or not is a different story.
peachlet420 : without become pedantic, asinine, or overly crass
ondoher1 : whoo hoo
peachlet420 : err becoming
peachlet420 : not become, I do know verb tenses
scotsmanmatt : radar: mmh...materialism is valid for materialists
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:13:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
scotsmanmatt : and?
ondoher1 : are you being pedantic now?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: and once the mythical becomes evidenced, it's no longer mythical. So what?
scotsmanmatt : radar: and it doesn't account for everything
peachlet420 : I don't know...probably
jaydmoore : anyhow, once again, grem, I'm sorry for wasting the time... I need to get going
rendermaster : better pendantic than pederastic ;)
ondoher1 : ?:))
scotsmanmatt : radar: for it doesn't account for the supernatural
peachlet420 : lol render
peachlet420 : true
peachlet420 : i don't have sex with little boys often
rendermaster : lol
jaydmoore : yes, grem, the same applies for "mythological"
rendermaster : just now and then? ;)
peachlet420 : though a lot of the men I deal with act like it at times
the_vampirre_lestat : is away (Auto-Away)
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:14:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
jaydmoore : mythological was never the issue
peachlet420 : only figuratively
ondoher1 : is gremlin posting?
the_vampirre_lestat : but if we could know ourselves not to possess exhaustive knowledge of the natural, how could we be in a position to say of any event that it was definitely supernatural?.......After all, it would always be possible for this event to have been naturally caused, although we could not know as yet know that to be so
the_vampirre_lestat : is back
peachlet420 : I mean, how many men actually exist?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: and, a few years ago, giant squids were mythological. Now they're real.
phosphorescentdesertbutt0ns : this is how i see it.. we are yet to discover all that is natural, therefore things such as aliens and bigfoot do not seem natural to us. from our world, we have applied laws of nature, and we assume that they apply outsidfe our world.
jaydmoore : because I view the mytholigical as supernatural
ondoher1 : oh, I see now
peachlet420 : very few
gremlin_net : Ondo: yeah.
jaydmoore : well, as close to supernatural as possible
jaydmoore : they weren't mythological, grem
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: you've still got it backwards. The supernatural is mythological; the mythological is not necessarily supernatural.
radardog : Scots- It does account for the supernatural, in that, so long as anything beyond nature happens, we were just wrong of our notions of what nature was. Arguments are valid so long they are logically coherent.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:15:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
ginxyz2000 : The mythological is NOT necessarily supernatural. The John Henry myth is a good example of this.
jaydmoore : everyone knew that the capacity was there... it just had not been observed
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: krakkens weren't mythological? All my books were wrong?
justme_161 : LOL
justme_161 : this room is lucky
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:16:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
justme_161 : every day that ive come here ive met an awesome girl the very same day:)
deadman_932 : isn't john henry folklore?
deadman_932 : heh
rendermaster : lol
ondoher1 : rolls an eleven
rendermaster : that's O henry :)
gremlin_net : The krakken was very much mythological. Then we catalogued A.dux and it became real.
justme_161 : LOL ond
jaydmoore : we have known that the capacity for the "giant squid" was there for a long time, grem... it had just never been observed.. you are confusing extraordinary with mythological
scotsmanmatt : radar: So if the law of physics were once overturned by a theist claiming to be acting through the power of an otherwordly deity then we were wrong about the law of physics and can't trust them any more?
deadman_932 : okay, we have legend, too
deadman_932 : folk legend?
gremlin_net : deadman_932: folklore, like cryptozoology and the supernatural, is a component of mythology.
ginxyz2000 : John Henry is folklore but he is also a part of American mythology
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:17:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
justme_161 : LOL nothing is every the same in this room
deadman_932 : hey, muhammad ali is a living legend
rendermaster : no, matt, it would just mean that the laws of physics would have to be ammended to include the new
michelle83201 : folklore and mythology are the same, imo
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: mythology is that immense genre of stuff not yet proved to be real. Whether the capacity for a thing to be real exists or not makes no difference.
michelle83201 : well, I should say that mythology is a subset of folklore
deadman_932 : and he be supernatural, bay-beeee
scotsmanmatt : render: so how would you amend the law of gravity to account for a one off event that contradicted that law?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:18:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
rendermaster : nothing is changed for one event
radardog : scots- Suppose a law of physics were overturned constantly by a simple prayer. Then it follows were we incorrect with the law, and a new one needs to be drafted to incorporate the prayer. Such as science now. As soon as there is evidence against a given law, it is either re-done, or we search for a new answer (understand nature in a different way).
rendermaster : it would take more than that to amend the law of physics
ginxyz2000 : The problem here is that J.D. is thinking that anything in the realm of mythology equates to being in the realm of the supernatural. This is not so.
justme_161 : no law is universal, a black hole contradicts gravity
gremlin_net : ginxyz2000: right.
justme_161 : we call that a phenomenon:)
scotsmanmatt : render: We're speaking hypothetically [although your own scriptures record that which you are denying]
jaydmoore : oh, grem, are you going back on your word?...a LONG time ago, I said that the "supernatural" would be better defined as "extraordinary"
gremlin_net : justme_161: black holes don't contradict gravity.
rendermaster : record what, matt?
jaydmoore : are you now agreeing?
scotsmanmatt : radar: I'm not speaking about 'constantly' but temporarily..for a few minutes or hours
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:19:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
deadman_932 : i dunno if the categories are all that clear to me
phosphorescentdesertbutt0ns : why don't you look up "supernatural" and "mythological" in a dictionary and compare??
ginxyz2000 : For example, American mythology has many stories that do not hint at anything supernatural.
deadman_932 : what would be included in supernatural that might overlap other areas?
scotsmanmatt : render: record things where things were changed for one vent
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: no I didn't. You mentioned something you considered to be supernatural, and I said that it was more extraordinary than supernatural.
jaydmoore : what is supernatural, ginxy?
rendermaster : matt, are you under the impression that since something is contained in the bible it somehow must be 100% historical fact that can be considered such without needing any evidence or proof?
justme_161 : gremlin, will you and I EVER agree on something???:)
jaydmoore : nothing is supernatural
radardog : scots- Even then, we need to account for a variable that only appears once. If it's observable long enough to obviously overturn preconcieved notions, then our notions were wrong.
jaydmoore : it is a contradiction in terms
gremlin_net : justme_161: probably....
jaydmoore : I don't think that YOU know what you are saying
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:20:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
deadman_932 : if fenris appeared, that would be the supernatural appearance of a mythological beastie, yes?
michelle83201 : donkeys talk too, render
jaydmoore : bullshit, grem
scotsmanmatt : radar: that is just a way to expain away any supernatural event.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: who are you talking to?
phosphorescentdesertbutt0ns : a lot of things have been categorised as supernatural, this does not make them so.
michelle83201 : like in the Old Testament
radardog : Scots- You're right, I shouldn't have added constantly; it isn't necessarily needed. If Gravity is violated once, we were inncorrect about something.
jaydmoore : that is a flat out lie
jaydmoore : you
scotsmanmatt : radar: that doesn't follow
ginxyz2000 : That which is supernatural is that which exists independently of the naturall functioning world and cannot be defined by that which we use to define the natural world.
jaydmoore : both of you
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: bullshit? Then show me where I said that extraordinary was synonymous with supernatural.
justme_161 : words are words
ginxyz2000 : naturally*
rendermaster : matt, reading about a supernatural event and experiencing or being present for one are not the same thing
jaydmoore : my scroll doesn't go back that far, grem
justme_161 : you can say see gravity is not universal
jaydmoore : you KNOW what you said
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: then you concede. Good.
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:21:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
scotsmanmatt : render: I expect theists to take their Scriptures as truth
phosphorescentdesertbutt0ns : that's what i hinted at before, ginxy
jaydmoore : you are just "saving face"
justme_161 : but i still cant float so why does it matter??:0
jaydmoore : coward
phosphorescentdesertbutt0ns : this is how i see it.. we are yet to discover all that is natural, therefore things such as aliens and bigfoot do not seem natural to us. from our world, we have applied laws of nature, and we assume that they apply outsidfe our world.
ginxyz2000 : Having been a Lit major, I can say that, in this respect, I know what I'm talking about,
ondoher1 : aliens and bigfoot?
jaydmoore : no, I don't think that you do, ginxy
scotsmanmatt : radar: The only way that your position follows is if you dismiss miracles from the outset
deadman_932 : poor ondo
radardog : Scots- Gravity asserts, with mathematical precision a force on objects. If this force is shown to be wrong, in even one instance, it does follow we were inncorrect in our equations.
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: I've got the transcript. I know what I said. You concede that you have no evidence of what you'd like to think I said. Consider that for a moment.
rendermaster : you had better speak with a rather large percentage of theists, matt, who don't consider the entire scripture to 100% historical fact just because it's written down
ondoher1 : don't forget the leprechauns
deadman_932 : i was confused, too:(
ondoher1 : deadman?
jaydmoore : you are making distinctions between mythological and supernatural
jaydmoore : supernatural doesn't even exist
jaydmoore : by definition
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:22:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
deadman_932 : still am, really
rendermaster : not all theists are complete fools, matt; believing that something is true and claiming it to be fact are two separate matters
jaydmoore : and you are saying that "not all mythology is supernatural"
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: are you certain that you want to baselessly assert that I said something you can't prove?
jaydmoore : that is some crazy fucking shit
jaydmoore : no matter how you cut it
scotsmanmatt : radar: But it isn't shown to be 'wrong'..it's suspended or altered by an otherworldy deity for a temporary period of time and then returns to its normal function
rendermaster : I can believe what is contained in the scrpiture, but I wouldn't claim it to be historicla fact
jaydmoore : grem
justme_161 : semantics is obviously the name of the game tonight
jaydmoore : you know what you said
jaydmoore : I have nothing more to say about htat
scotsmanmatt : render: eh...I didn't say the Scriptures were 100% historical fact
jaydmoore : that
justme_161 : lets play poker instead guys
blueorb9 : hi everyone
ondoher1 : deadman: bones of first coming through scene with purple frightens cowardly franks?
justme_161 : :)
rendermaster : then what is your point, matt?
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:23:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
rendermaster : or does a point exist?
scotsmanmatt : render: then your belief isn't worth anything..
ginxyz2000 : There IS a distinction....it exists all over literature and in the science of paranormal studies!! What part of this don't you get?
radardog : scots- Gravity asserts at all times. It doesn't allow for temporary fluxes.
rendermaster : lolol
deadman_932 : wow, ondo
catholicatheist : Shalom
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: yeah. I do know what I said. And if you haven't fully conceded that you don't know what I said in about a minute, I'm posting the fucking transcript and seeing whether you win Idiot of the Month here.
deadman_932 : now i'm really confused
ondoher1 : tries
scotsmanmatt : radar: you're missing the point...which is that you're everywhere assuming materialism
rendermaster : matt, when did you become God?
rendermaster : did someone vote?
jaydmoore : go ahead, grem
rendermaster : I missed going to the polls
blueorb9 : any athiests in here?
gremlin_net : jaydmoore: okay. Here goes....
jaydmoore : I'll be sure to check it out tomorrow
scotsmanmatt : render: one doesn't need to be God to know when a belief has merit
catholicatheist : so if I dont think jesus "christ" is the fucking messiah son of a virgin whore I gotta be atheist?
justme_161 : deals ddead man a hand
rendermaster : but quite like a xian to define what should and shouldn't be "worthwhile" or meaningful for everyone else
jaydmoore : literature... LOL
LOG DATA Sun, 9 Mar 2003 01:24:43 gremlin_net, ATHEIST vs. CHRISTIAN CHAT:1
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