celestial_zephyr : from the new testament
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : spherical_bastards = cattle.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * laughs.
     bbrillo : Numbers 31 "kill all the women, the boys, and the girls who have known a man, but save the virgins for yourself"
     phlegm_noir : rick: well, in the original story, it was just all the noise people made that pissed of the gods.
     rara_avis91 : <---sitting on an unclean chair
     celestial_zephyr : Im a christian I follow christs teachings
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: Why? Is it a different god in the NT?
     theophrenie : the bloody trail of the evil woman
     celestial_zephyr : oK
     banana_annie : me too, rara
     spherical_bastards : you familiar with what it says un educating a woman ?
     rara_avis91 * snicker
     bbrillo : "save ther virgins"...geee...thanks...god...J
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : it's a generality, god-of-arrogance. Or perhaps means they should find really tall husbands?
     spherical_bastards : or speaking in public ?
     goD_oF_arrogancE : bbrillo, yup, thats preety evil
     celestial_zephyr : NO
     irrefragabilis * obeys occasionally
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : phlegm_noir: But we're not dealing with the original story, we're dealing with the story presented by the final redactor.
     spherical_bastards : why not ?
     banana_annie : I wonder what would happen if I went into a fundie room and announced I was on the rag? Y
     spherical_bastards : dont' you read the bible ?
     rara_avis91 : lol annie
     celestial_zephyr : TELL ME
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Untied, lol
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * notes that it says that women should not speak in church.
     rara_avis91 : oh unclean whore!
     spherical_bastards : no answer first
     theophrenie : Annie, the "curse" ?
     stevensmirl : What matters to you as God per God se? Presence, knowledge, power.. money?
     eloheam_dammit : ever been to a woman prision?
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : lol annie
     bobv8ca : Y
     spherical_bastards : do you read the \bible
     celestial_zephyr : I SAOD NO
     banana_annie * giggles
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : M arrogance
     celestial_zephyr : DAMN CAPS
     celestial_zephyr : said
     phlegm_noir : You may be. I am not limiting my comments only to the biblical versions.
     christian_hillbilly_ky : (Gen. 2:23), and therefore the man has the preeminence. "The head of the woman is the man;" but yet honor is to be shown to the wife, "as unto the weaker vessel" (1 Cor. 11:3, 8, 9; 1 Pet. 3:7).
     bbrillo : <--couldnt get laid in a womans prison
     rara_avis91 : awww that's not true sweetie
     banana_annie * is getting punished because of eve
     theophrenie : bbrillo, whay?
     blue_stars_shiver : bob.. where are you?
     spherical_bastards : then how can yuo defend what you don't know , and why would i waste me time with someone who hasn't yet tries to defend it ?
     spherical_bastards : you*
     celestial_zephyr : umm rick . your the bible scholar right .
     larry_isley : I might be able to get laid in a womans prison
     goD_oF_arrogancE : bbrillo, sorry to hear that, you must be a fugly person
     theophrenie : why?
     eloheam_dammit : are you a woman
     stevensmirl : Don't hope. It's wrong.
     larry_isley : maybe
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : phlegm_noir: The discussion is over whether or not god created evil, or repented of his acts. The epic of Gilgamesh has nothing to do with that.
     rara_avis91 : goa...watch it mister...that's my boyfriend you're callin' fugly
     celestial_zephyr : You have gave me no verse on the wemon being treated like catttle
     blue_stars_shiver : Pray that there'll be another harvey oswald jr
     celestial_zephyr : Now give it to me
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : <~ wouldn't WANT to get laid in a women's prison
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Rara, oops, sorry
     banana_annie : wot dog said
     eloheam_dammit : lol
     larry_isley : heh
     rara_avis91 : lol dog
     celestial_zephyr : cell blick H
     celestial_zephyr : block
     spherical_bastards : but if i gacve it how would you know it ?
     blue_stars_shiver : bob.. nothing... Bush is a killer
     stevensmirl : HOld on hold on. .
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Rara, then give him some sex
     blue_stars_shiver : Who's Saddamizing Who?
     celestial_zephyr : Im waiting
     spherical_bastards : i couid be lieing
     spherical_bastards : lying*
     stevensmirl : could you refine the question a bit
     spherical_bastards : how would you know ?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: I'm familiar with scholarship, I'm not a scholar.
     rara_avis91 : who is bob?
     blue_stars_shiver : trentonator.. there are over 2000 tonnes of chem weapons in Alabama.. LOL
     phlegm_noir : Why limit the discussion to one single mythology?
     eloheam_dammit : difference is saddam might sell them to terrorism
     bobv8ca : this is bob
     rara_avis91 : oh
     celestial_zephyr : shut the fuck up till you give me a verse fromt he new testament how wemon are cattle
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Bob Villa?
     celestial_zephyr : jesus loved all .
     banana_annie : battery operated boyfriend
     larry_isley : would you trust Cuba with a nuke?
     celestial_zephyr : you dumb bitch
     bobv8ca : bob marly
     spherical_bastards : ow from the Nt ......you then deny Ot law ?
     rara_avis91 : jesus never existed...therefore he didn't love anyone
     spherical_bastards : you use under grace ?
     rara_avis91 : lol annie
     theophrenie : 2000 tons, about a day's worth for Baghdad
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: But spherical_bastards is right. Jesus and Paul lived and functioned in patristic societies. There was no feminist movement, no real discontent at how things were handled. The NT reflects that.
     spherical_bastards : to excuse yourself from law
     celestial_zephyr : oh wait
     spherical_bastards : though it says that he came not to abolish the laws ..
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : lol annie
     celestial_zephyr : im under the new covenatn
     spherical_bastards : were you being false ?
     celestial_zephyr : covanaant
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * notes that if Christians followed the Jewish Law, they'd be Jews. How they choose to understand their doctrines is up to them.
     buzzardrcok1 : You dont agree because you like terroists
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : You can't try and bind them to the Tanach.
     spherical_bastards : wait you were being a liar , false...
     spherical_bastards : you said you did not know the bible
     blue_stars_shiver : christian... there's no proof that anyone is up in a tree
     celestial_zephyr : no
     spherical_bastards : yet you did and lied
     celestial_zephyr : you did
     celestial_zephyr : no you did
     spherical_bastards : you are false
     eloheam_dammit : take him the fuck out!
     buzzardrcok1 : KILL HIM
     spherical_bastards : shalll i scroll up ?
     celestial_zephyr : No you said i knew
     celestial_zephyr : yes please
     spherical_bastards : you posted you didn't read the bible
     bbrillo : jesus be-a singin and a whittlin on the front porch with clem and earl
     celestial_zephyr : no i did not
     blue_stars_shiver : christian... Jesus would probably wouldn't kill anyone.
     theophrenie : dog, you are female?
     buzzardrcok1 : budda?
     spherical_bastards : ok i will repost what was said
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : yes theo
     rara_avis91 : :plays the theme from deliverance
     celestial_zephyr : now give me the verse of shut the fuck up
     rara_avis91 : shit
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Baghdad is one of the oldest cities on earth, built by who?
     theophrenie : All this time I didn't know.
     larry_isley : Dueling bNAJOS
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : lol rara
     larry_isley : wtf
     celestial_zephyr : i read my bible
     spherical_bastards : spherical_bastards: do you read the \bible celestial_zephyr: I SAOD NO
     celestial_zephyr : now im waiting
     rara_avis91 : actually i love that song
     eloheam_dammit : budda your gods will now kill yourself and go to heaven
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : i tell if i'm asked, but i'm rarely asked:p
     larry_isley : I gotta stop doing crack
     celestial_zephyr : not to that question
     blue_stars_shiver : Jesus never bombed anyone
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : phlegm_noir: The discussion is pertaining to the Christian God, and whether or not he created evil, and repented of his works. It really wouldn't make much sense to include other gods in that, nobody is questioning whether other gods created evil.
     spherical_bastards : i am waiting for you to be honest
     celestial_zephyr : your other dumb ass question
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Larry, crack kills
     theophrenie : Baghdad was built by Baghdadioes
     spherical_bastards : are you going to be honest ?
     blue_stars_shiver : Jesus Never Bombed Anyone
     hot_couple692003 : asked what untied??
     rara_avis91 : lol theo
     celestial_zephyr : you realy cant give me the verse
     spherical_bastards : or are you going to lie ?
     celestial_zephyr : no more text for you
     larry_isley : it kills typing ability
     spherical_bastards : yes i can , anyone in here can
     bbrillo : god drowns million of babies in a flood..god send bears to kill 42 children...god kills the first born of egypt
     larry_isley : that is obvious
     goD_oF_arrogancE : theo, right
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : asked whether i am a man or a woman
     spherical_bastards : but you were dishonest
     rara_avis91 : what verse?
     blue_stars_shiver : Bush doesn't give a crap about Iraqi's
     phlegm_noir : Okay, I'll give you that.
     bbrillo : kilkilkill...baby
     rara_avis91 : dog...are you a man or a woman?
     hot_couple692003 : are you a man or woman??
     spherical_bastards : you said you didn not read the bible
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : lol rara
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : <~woman
     blue_stars_shiver : Christian.. If Bush really cared about the people, he'd try to contain him, not bomb the country.
     banana_annie : hello radar
     radardog : Annie.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : 1Cr 11:7 For a man indeed ought not to cover [his] head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.
     rara_avis91 : dog is lying
     celestial_zephyr : now rick what were you saying .
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : O
     hot_couple692003 : cool
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Untied is a woman?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: I'm familiar with scholarship, I'm not a scholar.
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : me dog?
     theophrenie : Hi <~woman
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: But spherical_bastards is right. Jesus and Paul lived and functioned in patristic societies. There was no feminist movement, no real discontent at how things were handled. The NT reflects that.
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : yes goa
     celestial_zephyr : oh
     banana_annie * laughs at the revelations
     bbrillo : the christian god is too stupid and evil to deserve worship
     spherical_bastards : cles are you going to admit you lied ?
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Untied, cool
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : why does rara think i'm lying?
     blue_stars_shiver : Christian.. LOL.. The US kept sanctions going against the Iraqi's which killed millions of Iraqis. And you think we care?
     rara_avis91 : i'm only teasing sheesh
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : oh
     bbrillo : the christian god deserves ridicule
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : kinda on edge, sorry
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : :p
     hot_couple692003 : <----doesnt care if your lying
     rara_avis91 : pms?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : (lines 1 to 2) 1Cr 11:9 Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.
     eloheam_dammit : kill or be killed, pick one?
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Untied, maybe rara is a man
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : good excuse, rara
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : lol goa
     rara_avis91 : <---is a man
     goD_oF_arrogancE : hehe
     bbrillo : rara has a clit
     theophrenie : dammit, let me think? DOH!
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : (lines 1 to 1) 1Cr 11:6 For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.
     bbrillo : i saw it
     banana_annie * checks out rara's package
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : probably, coz no woman i know uses the phrase "on the rag"
     celestial_zephyr : yes you are right , socity did not change . but no where did Jesus ever teach anything but love and harmoney between people , men and wemon .
     esotericx10 : blue_stars_shiver where do you think we're going...? Into a school yard playground....?
     rara_avis91 : see...me and brill have just been jerkin' your chains...HE'S the woman and I'M the man
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Untied, true
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : on wait, that was annie, wasn't it
     blue_stars_shiver : Jesus says clearly, "LOVE YOUR ENEMY".. and God also says, "THOU SHALL NOT KILL"... What don't you not understand?
     celestial_zephyr : that has nothing to do with the teachings Of jesus .
     banana_annie : Y
     celestial_zephyr : NOTHING
     rara_avis91 : <---uses the phrase "on the rag"
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : <~ keeps forgetting to take that gingko biloba
     esotericx10 : WEe are going there to fight him AND his armed forces
     untied_dyslexic_church_of_dog : lol rara
     bbrillo : "but for mine enemies who dont want me to reign over them...slay them!!!" jesus says in luke 19:27
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: He didn't, per se. But neither does he express discontent at the patristic society he lived in.
     redleg662002 : thou shalt not murder
     spherical_bastards : lol
     bbrillo : .Matthew 10:34 jesus says.. "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
     blue_stars_shiver : esoterix.. not a playground.. LOL.. but when you're invading another country, you gotta to expect they'll shoot back
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: It is at least reasonable to conclude that he supported the social order.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : At least on that point.
     bbrillo : yeah...what dont you understand
     hot_couple692003 : lol brillo context context context
     theophrenie : Rags have evolved into femine hygiene napkins and other form factors.
     bbrillo : revelations ..."they were killed with the sword of jesus"
     banana_annie * thank goodness for tampons
     rara_avis91 : theo...a rag by any other name is still a rag
     bbrillo : yeah..understand
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : "Jesus the feminist" is no more valid than "Jesus the Revolutionary."
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Theo, but they still stink though
     celestial_zephyr : I dont read between the lines and your point is a self observance is all.
     self_interest_speaks * is back
     self_interest_speaks : Jesus the nudist revolutionary: sell your cloaks and buy swords N
     theophrenie : More info than I need.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Today's political motivations cannot be anachronistically attached to a first century Jew.
     bbrillo : only when jesus says "kill" it doesnt mean kill...only with jesus is this true
     rara_avis91 : lol
     blue_stars_shiver : Christian.. "getting it done".. means Organized Industrial Slaughter. LOL...
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * laughs at self_interest_speaks.
     goD_oF_arrogancE : theo, no it isnt, everyone should know
     rara_avis91 : when jesus says "kill" it means...by a hot dog with mustard and onions
     bbrillo : Matt:10:35: "For I am come to set a man against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law."
     esotericx10 : blue_stars_shiver War is NOT about a fair fight...we're professional boxers...we're going there to kick his ass as quickly as possible and that means taking every advantage that presents itself to us...and that also means limiting how many of OUR people get killed
     bbrillo : understand?
     blue_stars_shiver : Who think Bush Jr actually cares about IRAQ'S? As far as I remember he keeps saying, "GOD BLESS AMERICA"
     eloheam_dammit : buddha, lifes a bitch, fuck some one or get fucked, pic one?
     bbrillo : lol...rara
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: No, it isn't. It's a reasonable conclusion. Mary, for example, sits at his feet while Martha cooks and prepares the table (or maybe vice versa. . . )
     knight_of_baawa : self, I just found out that the UK has 5 fucking communist parties
     hot_couple692003 : laughs at atheist whgo quote the bible
     theophrenie : I don't sniff there, but I guess somemen do.
     esotericx10 : *we're NOT professional boxers
     celestial_zephyr : your conclusion
     self_interest_speaks : knight, oh well.. I suppose it's not surprising
     blue_stars_shiver : esoterix.. I contend he didn't even have to enter that ring.
     rara_avis91 : i have to pee
     rara_avis91 : brb
     celestial_zephyr : soo she loved jesus
     knight_of_baawa : No, it isn't
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : There's no indication that his disciples preformed tasks typically assigned to women.
     bbrillo : when hitler said "kill"..it meant kill...when stalin said "kill" it meant kill...
     knight_of_baawa : But *5*!
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : He wasn't a feminist.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : There were no feminists.
     bbrillo : when jesus says "kill"...not so fuckin fast...brother
     celestial_zephyr : how do you know.
     celestial_zephyr : how the hell do you know
     blue_stars_shiver : For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son. GW Bush loved the oil so much, that he gave everyone elses
     larry_isley : trent and that is somehow wrong?
     self_interest_speaks : knight, I wonder what they disagree with each other about... maybe what sort of people should be killed in the coming revolution N
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Theo, youve never eaten pussy?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: Because of the absence of any mention of it in texts of that time.
     celestial_zephyr : I cook for my guest
     celestial_zephyr : and what does that mean
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Had there been adversarial stances, we should expect to find reference to them.
     theophrenie : blue star, do you drive a car?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : It means that there were no feminists.
     knight_of_baawa : Communist Party of Britain Communist Party of Britain Marxist-Leninist Communist Party of Great Britain New Communist Party of Britain New Communist Party of Britain
     blue_stars_shiver : theophrenie.. sometimes
     hot_couple692003 : has anyone ever farted during sex??????
     esotericx10 : blue_stars_shiver Well....he did....now its time to stop bitching about it...I'm not in favor of this war either...BUT I supporet my military people completely
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Relax, that's not a personal insult, and has no reflection on your face. Jesus fit the world he lived in.
     bbrillo : i farted during birth
     knight_of_baawa : Revolutionary Communist Party of Great Britain
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Perhaps if he lived today he'd support Gloria Steinem.
     eloheam_dammit : were not going to war without benifits......if your mad about oil than burn your car in protest......
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Who knows.
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Hot, some women do
     celestial_zephyr : just becuse it was not alwoed does not mean it does nto exist . As you much as you want to belive wemon in histoy had no minds YOUR WRONG rick
     blue_stars_shiver : esotericx.. oh sorry, I hold justice and God above my government or soldier
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : But he didn't, and he doesn't.
     hot_couple692003 : lol brillo in your birth???
     knight_of_baawa : I think so, self. Who will be the first against the wall when the revolution comes
     bbrillo : no...my mothers
     blue_stars_shiver : BOMBS FOR FREEDOM ... LOL
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: I didn't say it wasn't allowed. I said it is never mentioned.
     bbrillo : sheesh
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : By anyone.
     celestial_zephyr : behind every great man is a woman
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : NT or otherwise.
     phlegm_noir : celestial: you're not understanding what rick is saying
     celestial_zephyr : i guess im not
     banana_annie : cherchez la femme
     indondasani : greetings, all.
     blue_stars_shiver : BUSH IS LIBERATING IRAQI'S FROM LIFE
     larry_isley : we (any nation that recognizes human rights) have the moral right to replace any dictatorship at any time, we are not OBLIGATED to, when it is in our interst, we may
     banana_annie : hello indon
     spherical_bastards : well even in revelations women were so loved .....symbolized as whores..
     bbrillo : behind every gay man is another gay man
     eloheam_dammit : support terrorism, be a protester
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: Jesus fit the social context of first century Galilee.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Not twentieth century America.
     blue_stars_shiver : For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son. GW Bush loved the oil so much, that he gave everyone elses
     celestial_zephyr : oh he did
     theophrenie : Oil is the most important strategic factor is Waging a War. No army that runs out of Oil has a chance. Oil is national Security, the more Oil, the more security. it's that simple.
     goD_oF_arrogancE : I support me
     rara_avis91 : back
     esotericx10 : blue_stars_shiver You talk like Saddam is a nice guy....get real.. the man is a monster and he deserves what he is getting...the only sad part is the innocent people that will be killed because of him
     bbrillo : jesus smelled bad
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : He must. That is the context in which he lived.
     banana_annie : wb rara
     larry_isley : as you should
     bbrillo : wb sweetie
     rara_avis91 : ty annie
     rara_avis91 : ty sweetie J
     celestial_zephyr : I dont think he did
     blue_stars_shiver : Bush <-- Man this guy is an idiot
     knight_of_baawa : self, does Canada have the Moral Power Communist Party?
     spherical_bastards : rev 17 : 1-5 ...
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * laughs.
     self_interest_speaks : knight, not that I know of
     celestial_zephyr : i think he was very different and was killed for it .
     knight_of_baawa : hmmmm
     hot_couple692003 : I protest farting during sex!!!!!!!!!!
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : But you think that without evidence.
     indondasani : larry; so, should our nation ever violate the rights of its citizens such that our neighbors can not abide by it, other countries have the right to invade us and plunder our national resources?
     larry_isley : I thought that was the ruling body in canada
     knight_of_baawa : What about just the Moral Power Party?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Why is being killed such a mark of difference?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Crucifixion was common.
     self_interest_speaks : blue_stars_shiver would prefer Saddam's leadership to George W. Bush's, I'm sure.
     bbrillo : plunder me...baby
     blue_stars_shiver : Esotericx.. LOL.. I'm against both Saddam and Bush jr. If you say Saddam is so bad, it's still no excuse to blow away innocent people. Think about it.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : "there was not enough room for the crosses and not enough crosses for the bodies"(War.5.11.1)
     bbrillo : heh
     celestial_zephyr : adn your point
     rara_avis91 * plunder plunder
     celestial_zephyr : and
     bbrillo : lol
     rara_avis91 : lol
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: That even his death fits his social context.
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Bonds, because once you are killed, you are not alive?
     blue_stars_shiver : Esotericx.. if you say the Ends justify the Means.. then anything goes.
     spherical_bastards : Cor. 14:34-35 ....no tallowed to be educated or speak ...
     celestial_zephyr : jesus did not live as a typical glaian
     spherical_bastards : what a loving god you have celes
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : celestial_zephyr: Again, a first century Jewish context, not a twentieth century context.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : spherical_bastards: I already posted that.
     hot_couple692003 : Jesus was a hippy
     blue_stars_shiver : JESUS DIED FOR US.. HE DIDN'T KILL
     bbrillo : jesus is a stolen pagan myth...people take him a bit too seriously
     larry_isley : indon well I ahven't seen any plundering ...yet, but that not withstanding, if the US is ever being run by someone like Hussein, who evaporates Dallas on a whim, yeah I hope someone steps up
     theophrenie : Saddam is bad, and removing Saddam saves lives, stops tortures, and other abuse of innocents.
     hot_couple692003 : long haired and loved everybody
     rara_avis91 : jesus did not exist...he neither lived nor died
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : And you forgot 1 Cor. You can't just identify it as Cor and expect anyone to know what you mean.
     blue_stars_shiver : rara.. and what do you call your system of beliefs?
     banana_annie : I remember jesus really resonating with hippies back in the late 60's and early 70's
     larry_isley : indon but I don't feel they are obligated to
     theophrenie : If you can get saddam to die for us,, have at it.
     rara_avis91 : i don't have any beliefs hun
     bbrillo : jesus exists in the mind of hillbillies and mental defectives
     indondasani : larry; I don't doubt that deposing some leaders is a good thing. But, the US is going to extract... or perhaps, extort, a price more than worth it.
     theophrenie : I was a Jesus freak Annie.
     josette638 : corinthians
     phlegm_noir : rara: it's entirely possible that a galilean rabbi named Jesus preached in the first century.
     celestial_zephyr : so you are saying jesus lived as anyother man . Becuse some wemon cooked for him and washed his feet with her hair ?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * notes that rara_avis91's position is certainly not representative of scholarship at large, and there are NO scholarly debates, or even real academic dissent on the existence of an historical Jesus.
     blue_stars_shiver : rara.. then that is your system.. a belief of nothing. We all believe in something.
     hot_couple692003 : rara.... then what aren you arguing against ...someone that never existed???
     banana_annie : lol.....yep....the term jesus freak was coined......wow theo
     goD_oF_arrogancE : rara, you believe in nothing?
     rara_avis91 : phlegm...there is no evidence to support it however
     larry_isley : indon so it is in our interest, I'm not sure I should feel to bad about that, considering the price we'll pay
     self_interest_speaks : Calgary, I have a question.. maybe I asked before, though. What do you think happened to Jesus' body?
     rara_avis91 : Rick...incorrect
     self_interest_speaks : was there ever a body? Did it even get to a tomb? What happened afterwards if it did?
     celestial_zephyr : i belive this was about wemon ?
     blue_stars_shiver : We're TYPING
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : rara_avis91: Perhaps you'd care to rebut this? It was presented by Peter Kirby on the JesusMysteries E-List some time ago. http://www.geocities.com/seeker_of_smooth_things/Peters_argument.html
     blue_stars_shiver : Press 1, if you think Bush Jr is misguided
     blue_stars_shiver : 1
     goD_oF_arrogancE : cool
     bbrillo : "close historical analysis of the Gospels exposes most of them as inauthentic; that, by inference, most Christians' picture of Christ may be radically misguided. That their Jesus, in fact, "is an imaginative theological construct"
     bbrillo : http://www.time.com/time/magazine/archive/1996/dom/960408/cover.html
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : rara_avis91: Name one scholarly debate on the matter. One that is carried out in peer reviewed journals, or academic e-lists.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Just one.
     bbrillo : no debate???
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : self_interest_speaks: It was probably left on the cross. The tomb is a later apologetic.
     indondasani : larry; well, if it is a morally good thing... we would want other nations to do it for us, if we ever needed it.
     redleg662002 : koreans are not as likely to surrender
     spherical_bastards : jesus never died .......how the fuck does a god die ?
     blue_stars_shiver : Trent.. are you talking about Bush or President of N Korea?
     rara_avis91 : Rick...how about if you just name the historian who actually lived during the time jesus allegedly did and mentions his name? can you do that?
     esotericx10 : blue_stars_shiver I've already stated my position towards this war.....so obviously I've thought about it...and I'm not so naive as to think that the reason why are there is to liberate the Iraqi people although hopefully that will be a side benefit
     phlegm_noir : Well, rara, the synoptics do seem to point to a common source of wisdom sayings that seem to have come from a single teacher.
     spherical_bastards : silly shit
     banana_annie : hello swyndle
     self_interest_speaks : Calgary, interesting.. was that usual for crucifixions?
     Swyndle : " I am aware now, that everythings gonna be fine, one day, too late..."
     goD_oF_arrogancE : there is no picture of jesus
     bbrillo : That their Jesus, in fact, "is an imaginative theological construct"
     eloheam_dammit : if you realy trust your god, than why are you worried about this war?
     bbrillo : no debate?
     Swyndle : Hiya, Nana.
     larry_isley : China could throw bodies at ya all day
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : rara_avis91: I don't debate the historicity of Jesus. It's a waste of time, because so few are really familiar with the methods. Take a look at the article I linked, and, if you can name ONE scholarly debate on the matter, I'll partake.
     spherical_bastards : well god ...it san "inspired" image ...
     blue_stars_shiver : esotericx.. thanks for admitting it's not about any humanitarian purpose, so how do you justify this war then?
     spherical_bastards : its an *
     spherical_bastards : lol
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Otherwise, I throw my hat in with "scholarly consensus."
     blue_stars_shiver : Russia is around
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : self_interest_speaks: Yes.
     rara_avis91 : lmao Rick...of course
     goD_oF_arrogancE : true
     theophrenie : Larry, we can incinerate bodies all day
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : rara_avis91: Again, you said I lied. Name one scholarly debate.
     blue_stars_shiver : Russia is the one selling its WMD to anyone
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Just one.
     bbrillo : "the jesus seminar"....scholarly debate
     larry_isley : theo its a LOT of bodies
     rara_avis91 : nevermind...another pseudo intellectual know nothing making assertions he cannot substantiate
     larry_isley : J
     bbrillo : 10 years
     rara_avis91 : *CLICK*
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : And take a look at the argument I linked, from Peter Kirby.
     bbrillo : 75 bible scholars
     bbrillo : the jesus seminar
     bbrillo : jesus is a myth
     spherical_bastards : bbrillo is the man
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : rara_avis91: I claimed that scholarly consensus is unanimous.
     Swyndle : I hate it when I come in in the middle.
     indondasani : we can bomb chinese bodies all day.
     larry_isley : I mean the ocean is deep and all
     spherical_bastards : lol
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Care for some names?
     rara_avis91 : yes...bbrillo is the man lol
     banana_annie : it's always the middle, swyndle
     theophrenie : Larry, raw numbers in battle are no longer strategically important as other factors.
     self_interest_speaks : Calgary, someone mentioned the Jesus Seminar.. does that count?
     Swyndle : Nana, point.
     hot_couple692003 : <-----doesnt believe bbrillo exists
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Swyndle, i often cum in the middle my self
     banana_annie * chuckles
     rara_avis91 : <---doesn't care whether hot believes bbrillo exists or not
     bbrillo : i can name all 75 bible scholars...christians..jews...atheists...10 years...jesus is a myth
     Swyndle : god_of_arrogance, that was more than I needed to know thanks.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : John Crossan, E P Sanders, paula fredriksen, James Still, Marcus J. Borg, Vermes, Brown, Funk, Allison, Levine, etc etc.
     celestial_zephyr : sheprical that refrence is to being in church
     celestial_zephyr : not in general
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : self_interest_speaks: Of course it does.
     larry_isley : well taking Nukes out of the equation, sooner or later you almost have to occupy
     goD_oF_arrogancE : Swyndle, just jokin, but welcome
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : rara_avis91: I provided an argument, made by an expert. That you fail to read or address it is your problem.
     spherical_bastards : why wouldn't a women be able to speak in her " fathers" hous e?
     larry_isley : not required I suppose...but
     celestial_zephyr : infact i dont think wemon were alowed to even go to church when men did
     bbrillo : look up "jesus seminar"...see scholarly debate...jesus is a myth..that was the conclusion
     spherical_bastards : not*
     celestial_zephyr : dont know
     celestial_zephyr : ask god
     spherical_bastards : are women less than men ?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : bbrillo: NO it certainly wasn't.
     self_interest_speaks : Calgary, someone's claming the Jesus Seminar concluded that Jesus is a myth
     spherical_bastards : why was men allowed totalk ?
     self_interest_speaks : oops, you see him M
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Would you like a link to the JS site?
     spherical_bastards : and women not ?
     rara_avis91 : do a search on The Jesus Puzzle...if you dare
     spherical_bastards : well seeing how god doesn't existwhats the chances of that ?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : rara_avis91: Earl Doherty's Jesus Puzzle is the only good Jesus myth theory ever presented.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : But it fails, Peter Kirby shows why in the link I provided.
     celestial_zephyr : i ber you embarrase your husband all the time spherical
     rara_avis91 : in fact...do a search on "historical jesus" and see if you can find even one single historian *who lived during the time jesus allegedly lived* who mentions his name...you will come up empty
     celestial_zephyr : thats what it means
     bbrillo : coming directly from the conclusion of the jesus seminar: Jesus, in fact, "is an imaginative theological construct"
     blue_stars_shiver : All Empires eventually fall.. Daniel 2
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : I, in fact, have the Jesus Puzzle right in front of me.
     hot_couple692003 : wonders how their could be a "Jesus seminar if he doesnt exist
     bbrillo : thats a direct quote...scholarly debate...jesus is a fraud
     spherical_bastards : why was women unclean longer when giving birth to females them males ?
     spherical_bastards : were we nasty ?
     larry_isley : Am I the only person that thinks popularity is over rated
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : bbrillo: You lie.
     blue_stars_shiver : All Empires eventually fall.. Daniel 2... Therefore do we want to exit our superpower status having pissed off all the other countries?
     rara_avis91 : larry isn't here
     indondasani : rara; all that can mean is that jesus was considered unimportant.
     bbrillo : look it up...
     theophrenie : Annie, Jesus freaks of the 60's were about peace, truth, love, brotherhood of man. Not about sex, drugs and Rock n Roll.
     blue_stars_shiver : It was bush jr and his neo-conservatives.. messing around with the world
     banana_annie : yes, theo
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : I have "The Acts of Jesus" "The Five Gospels" (both publications of the complete JS right here)
     larry_isley : well then the UN should get thier heads out of their asses and DO something
     bbrillo : THE GOSPEL TRUTH? http://westarinstitute.org/Fellows/fellows.html
     Swyndle : Damned phone.
     bbrillo : look it up
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : I also have numerous works of Crossan, Borg, Funk, etc etc.
     bbrillo : i did
     Swyndle : I gotta go.
     Swyndle : Later.
     indondasani : larry; the problem with using popularity as a judgement of quality or other good things is the assumption inherent that all people have good judgement.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : bbrillo: again, you lies.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : And that's only the "Fellows of the JS"
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : A list of names.
     bbrillo : http://www.time.com/time/magazine/archive/1996/dom/960408/cover.html
     banana_annie * had hip huggers and a peace symbol to hang around her neck
     larry_isley : indon I tend to agree
     hot_couple692003 : <-----Jesus freaks od 2003 who are about sex and rock and roll...no drugs
     blue_stars_shiver : America <--- How come we always say GOD BLESS AMERICA.. what about the rest of the WORLD?
     lyth_ande : Hello Rick.
     bbrillo : keep looking..it aint a rumor
     banana_annie : hello lyth
     lyth_ande : annieJ
     larry_isley : Ok so Libya thinks we are assholes....and?
     indondasani : but, I believe that good judgement could be taught.
     larry_isley : who cares
     self_interest_speaks : Calgary, he could be quoting the conclusion correctly.. he only quoted "is an imaginative theological construct" which could be prefixed by "the Jesus most people believe in is..."
     bbrillo : "There are, after all, four Gospels, whose actual writing, most scholars have come to acknowledge, was done not by the Apostles but by their anonymous followers (or their followers' followers). Each presented a different picture of Jesus' life..The first seems to have been written in 80AD"
     lyth_ande : Indon-Who's up on inkfidels this week?
     hot_couple692003 : the hell with the rest of the world
     banana_annie : red skelton said god bless everyone
     knight_of_baawa : lyth
     lyth_ande * has time.
     bbrillo : from the jesus seminar
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : bbrillo: You lie. The Jesus Seminar ruled that 17 percent of what Jesus said, and 14 percent of what Jesus did is historical.
     lyth_ande : knightJ
     bbrillo : jesus is a fraud...get over it
     larry_isley : indon that wasn't directed at your statement
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * laughs.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * laughs and laughs.
     indondasani : lyth; whenever ondo gets around to switching things around, it'll be the first couple chapters of Magi.
     trentonator : brb
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : I have almost every work the JS has ever published RIGHT here.
     larry_isley : I actaully agree that good judgement can be taught
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Right in front of me.
     indondasani : first three, if I can finish the third fast enough.
     blue_stars_shiver : God's blessing is given to be shared. If we don't SHARE OUR BLESSING.. it becomes a curse.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : I subscribe to the 4th R.
     spherical_bastards : Ecclesiastes : This is what I have found, reasoning things out one by one, after searching long without success: I have found one man in a thousand worthy to be called upright, but I have not found one woman among them all"< why did he give us pussies if he was going to use it against us ?
     bbrillo : no..what they said was ONLY 14 % could be concidered historical..not that it was historical
     bbrillo : you fuckin liar
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : And also have numerous articles and essays published by them.
     spherical_bastards : get em bbrillo
     bbrillo : why do christian have to lie ALL THE TIME??
     theophrenie : blue Star, Theocentric chauvanism comes from the Judeo/Christian leadrship, America's leaders.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : No, they said it *was* considered historical by the fellows of the JS.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : The red beads.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : I'm not Christian.
     larry_isley : bobv8ca can they? then WHY aren't they?
     rara_avis91 : <---unignoring Rick to see his demise
     larry_isley : interesting
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : I'm just familiar with scholarship.
     banana_annie : um......I have a suggestion......if you are going to post a long post, do it in emote form to save room and make it easier to read.......just a suggestion
     spherical_bastards : bbrillo , god iinspires them too .
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : I never gave any indication I was Christian.
     spherical_bastards : oops
     spherical_bastards : typo
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : The Jesus Seminar voted, using beads, on what was historical in the gospels.
     bbrillo : wrong...only 14% could have been said by jesus....that doesnt make him real and the jesus seminar doesnt claim jesus ever existed
     larry_isley : of course you can go against the UN, Iraq has been doing it for 20 years
     blue_stars_shiver : theophrenie... thank God. I know God wants to bless all the nations, not just America... I never even seen him mention America in the bible.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Their works, "The Five Gospels" and "The Acts of Jesus"
     self_interest_speaks : if 14 percent of what Jesus did was historical, then there had to be someone to do that... that seems pretty logical
     theophrenie : and was the seminar correct?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : bbrillo: yes, they do.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : bbrillo: The majority of the JS is, in fact, Christian.
     irrefragabilis : LOL @ rick's demise. i've never seen that
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Perhaps you should read the site you just linked?
     bbrillo : to state that the 14% figure implies a historical jesus is a fuckin lie
     self_interest_speaks : Brillo, what kind of moron are you? How could even some of the things that Jesus did be historical if there was no Jesus to do them?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Crossan (co-chair of the seminar) Christian.
     eloheam_dammit : god ante going to help us than fuck him too
     blue_stars_shiver : Bush Jr has taken us back about 50 years.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Borg, Christian
     goD_oF_arrogancE : lol
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Funk. (other co-chair) Christian.
     spherical_bastards : hmm
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Miller, Christian.
     bbrillo : yes...most of the bible scholars were christian...it makes their conclusion more interesting
     hot_couple692003 : .....notices the bbrillo has spent a lot of time studying the man called Jesus whom he doesnt believe exists.......interesting
     lyth_ande : lol
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : You lie.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : You're making their conclusions up.
     rara_avis91 : lol
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Perhaps you would care to show me where the JS says that there was no historical Jesus?
     rmugedn : much better
     irrefragabilis : rmug
     banana_annie : I used to read a lot about king arthur.....his existence isn't validated yet, either
     rmugedn : dustay
     rmugedn : annay
     bbrillo : no..i'm quoting it word for word..and i gave you links...you are a fuckin liar....bonds
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Perhaps you would care to explain why almost every member has published reconstructions of the HJ if they say there wasn't one?
     banana_annie : hey rmug
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * laughs.
     indondasani : ambassador; you said you had the JS homepage, or something similar?
     blue_stars_shiver : I got a Christian question. When the rich young ruler couldn't give up his wealth to follow Christ, is that GOD'S FAULT OR THE RICH YOUNG RULERS?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : The link you gave lists the fellows of the JS.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : And that's all it has.
     bbrillo : go to the home page..you moron...
     blue_stars_shiver : They'd be ISLAMIC if they were democratic.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : As well as a little information published by each.
     theophrenie : hot, one cannot ignore Jesus as a cultural phenomena, but in now way does that make a Jesus a real person.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : I've got it open right now.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Give me a more specific link.
     rara_avis91 : theo...exactly
     bbrillo : go..to...the...westar....homepage...its an internet thing
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : That lists the fellows.
     irrefragabilis : yea more sponge bob!
     indondasani : ok, then.
     bbrillo : fuck you you moron
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Link from the side to the periodicals, and outlines of the JS' work.
     eloheam_dammit : god wants money, ask the cathlics.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : The JS is an internet thing?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * rolls on the floor laughing his ass off.
     theophrenie : Mythology is over 12000 years old. There has been a lot of time to perfect it.
     self_interest_speaks : What a fucking liar Brillo is.. bbrillo : "close historical analysis of the Gospels exposes most of them as inauthentic; that, by inference, most Christians' picture of Christ may be radically misguided. That their Jesus, in fact, 'is an imaginative theological construct' " != Jesus is a myth. Either Brillo is a misguided fool or a deliberate liar.
     trentonator : better at what dusty?
     bbrillo : cant use the internet and will lecture everyone on the historicity of jesus
     trentonator : K
     spherical_bastards : now i read the findings were based on presuppositions and not historical findings ..
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : The Jesus Seminar was formed in the 80s. It's not a "internet thing."
     irrefragabilis : trenton better at being entertaining
     rmugedn : yawn...
     rmugedn : the room is miiiighty boring tonight
     self_interest_speaks : Brillo, why don't you leave the room, you pathetic fuckwit? Calgary's beaten you at your own game. LOL
     hot_couple692003 : so who was the genius that invernted this "myth" that has changed millions upon millions of lives over 2000 years??
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Show me where on that page it says there was no historical Jesus?
     irrefragabilis : OMG it's the Lost Episode!
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Show me.
     self_interest_speaks : Calgary, I'm waiting to see that, too
     rmugedn : lmfao@hot_couple
     self_interest_speaks : his SOLE quote doesn't even demonstrate what he claims it demonstrates
     rmugedn : what a stupid question...
     rmugedn : oh boy...
     theophrenie : Lost episode?
     celestial_zephyr : damn im an american
     hot_couple692003 : some smart person there he was
     celestial_zephyr : glad i was born in
     self_interest_speaks * watches Brillo go down in hot, smelly flames, like a dung fire
     celestial_zephyr : shit
     irrefragabilis : it's lost
     bbrillo : Jesus and Mithras...both born of a virgin...both members of the Sacred Trinity...both born in caves on December 25th....both said to be "the light of the world"...both taught of salvation to heaven and escape from hell..both taught of a final day of judgement..both practiced baptism by water..both died in the spring and were resurrected..both commanded "eat my body...drink my blood"...both ascended into heaven to watch over the faithful.
     banana_annie : and no......I have no scholarly evidence to back up my belief about that
     lyth_ande * laughs her arse off.
     presby_youth_ministry_intern : Hey room
     phlegm_noir : hot couple: you are really out of your depth here
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : self_interest_speaks: I have almost every publication the Jesus Seminar ever published--in any fashion--right here.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : I can reach it from where I'm sitting.
     bbrillo : Thousands of years before Jesus, there was a passion story told about a God man, Dionysus, born of a virgin mother- in a stable. He travels about with his followers, preaching and performing miracles, until one day he is allows himself to be arrested and tried for blasphemy. He is found guilty and executed, only to rise from the grave three days later, where the women weeping at his tomb do not recognize him.
     rmugedn * concurs with phlegm
     knight_of_baawa : Back for round 2, presby?
     self_interest_speaks : Calgary, I KNOW you're informed... I know he's not M
     spherical_bastards : http://www.jesus-seminar.net/
     bbrillo : yeah...jesus really lived
     hot_couple692003 : well can anyone answer the question??
     bbrillo : sure did
     trentonator : was I suppose be entertaining dusty?
     theophrenie : Well said bbrillo
     rmugedn : hot: it's not a valid question
     irrefragabilis : yes trenton
     rara_avis91 : exactly brill
     irrefragabilis : it's ok
     trentonator : what is bob saying that is entertaning?
     indondasani : "At the close of debate on each agenda item, Fellows of the Seminar vote, using colored beads to indicate the degree of authenticity of Jesus' words or deeds. "
     hot_couple692003 : why not if hes a myth then someone somewhere had to start this myth
     indondasani : it appears that the existence of Jesus is presupposed by the Seminar.
     rmugedn : and?
     irrefragabilis : trenton neither of you are entertaining. i'm watching a tv show called sponge bob...
     rmugedn : what's your point
     bbrillo : Aside from Christ and Mithras, there were many other deities (such as Osiris, Tammuz, Adonis, Balder, Attis, and Dionysus) said to have died and resurrected. Many classical heroic figures, such as Hercules, Perseus, and Theseus and historical figures such as Alexander the Great , were said to have been born of a virgin mother.
     irrefragabilis : you idiot
     phlegm_noir : Brill: no one is disputing that much myth and legend has been attatched to the historic Jesus.
     self_interest_speaks : Calgary, I think you sent him off on a tangent, lol
     banana_annie * . o O ( what's this world coming to? Atheists are arguing with atheists now.....S )
     irrefragabilis : brillo ignored him
     indondasani : their page doesn't talk about proving or disproving Jesus... but of "Finding the Real Jesus".
     rmugedn : annie:s ooin there will be atheistic sects S
     bbrillo : yeah...a hundred pagan gods all who just happened to lived the exact same live as jesus
     theophrenie : The conclusions of the Seminar supports the non literal view of the Bible.
     hot_couple692003 : my point is that it had to be the biggest scam of all time
     trentonator : welll, I never heard of that show Dusty.... There's a guy on the mic called bob...
     colorofjanuary : word.
     banana_annie : lol rara
     bbrillo : all before jesus
     grapesofmelancholy : lmao at hotcouple69. after trying to prove jesus in this room they will probably trapse off to play in a masturbation room
     bbrillo : and yeah..jesus is historical
     trentonator : I thought you were referring to him
     rmugedn : hrmm... were greek myths used as a scam ever?
     rmugedn : no
     irrefragabilis : it's ok. i'm ignore for being racist
     bbrillo : just a coincidence
     rara_avis91 : annie?
     rmugedn : your point has no valid basis
     celestial_zephyr : bbillo do you ever get a date on saturday night?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : indondasani: The Historical Jesus has been simply accepted by contemporary scholars since Strauss. I actually take a more liberal stance, and state that it is reasonable to doubt his historicity, but marginally more reasonable to rule in favor of it. I believe I gave you the link to Peter's argument in the past.
     rara_avis91 : what did i say that was funny? lol
     irrefragabilis : trenton yea
     rmugedn : and seems like a non sequiter to me
     irrefragabilis : i know
     hot_couple692003 : not trying to prove Jesus
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : self_interest_speaks: He has no idea what he's talking about.
     self_interest_speaks : can someone ask Brillo why he hasn't supplied a quote from the Jesus Seminar concluding that Jesus is a myth, and not just that some people have wrong beliefs about him?
     goD_oF_arrogancE : who is a racist?
     indondasani : ambassador; you did.
     self_interest_speaks : Calgary, I know.. not the first time I've noticed it
     theophrenie : The Greek oracles received great accalim and some wealth.
     theophrenie : acclaim
     indondasani * takes a neural position on the existence of Jesus, himself.
     rmugedn : theo: but from exploiting people?
     rmugedn : hardly
     banana_annie : shit, sorry, rara.....that was rmug.....
     rara_avis91 : LOL
     hot_couple692003 : not going to a masterbatinoi room either......why you know a good one??
     banana_annie : the room was moving way too fast
     esotericx10 : indondasani As do I
     bbrillo : there isnt a shread of evidence that jesus ever lived
     rara_avis91 : i'm goin'...geez...am i chatting by osmosis now???
     bbrillo : not a shrread
     theophrenie : Yes, from exploiting people seeking their futures
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * does not take a neutral position.
     bbrillo : no birth records
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : It's easier to explain the silence of Paul (the strongest argument against an historical Jesus) than it is to explain the criteria of dissimilarity.
     bbrillo : death records
     grapesofmelancholy : heh hot
     indondasani : and yet, the Jesus Seminar assumes that Jesus existed.
     bbrillo : trial records
     eloheam_dammit : santa says hes in it for x-mass but we all know he's in it for the $
     bbrillo : citizenship recorts
     theophrenie : kings consulted oracles for outcomes of battle, for eexample
     rmugedn : theo: i'm still not sure as to how the greek myths were used in this
     bbrillo : physical evidence
     self_interest_speaks : I'm really interested in Brillo providing this quote, since he is so familiar with the conclusions of the Jesus Seminar. I'd hate to have to concldue that he's a cow fucking, unknowing cum drinker (although rara_avis91 does remind me of something bovine)
     grapesofmelancholy : hotcouple, it seems it would be prudent to have a second i.d. when coming to rooms like this
     christian_hillbilly_ky * laughs at bbrillo
     bbrillo : journal records
     hot_couple692003 : why grapes???
     theophrenie : OK, study Greek Myths, especially the Muses.
     bbrillo : writting by jesus.writting about jesus
     grapesofmelancholy : "hi, my name is big_one692003 and you ought to believe in jesus"
     banana_annie : lordy
     bbrillo : no statues at the time
     colorofjanuary : *L* grapes.
     self_interest_speaks : come on, Brillo, don't be shy.. present the quote. You must have many quotes from the Jesus Seminar demonstrating your position.
     rara_avis91 : lol grapes
     bbrillo : no death records
     larry_isley : there is no discernable valuein brotherhood, that I can see
     rmugedn : ah yes
     bbrillo : no artifacts
     theophrenie : There is a rich tradition of Greek mythology ' the everyday lives of the Greeks.
     hot_couple692003 : did i ever say to anyone """you ought to believe in Jesus" ???
     goD_oF_arrogancE : True, jesus gave seminars
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : indondasani: Again, it's been accepted as a given since Strauss--since methods were developed during the enlightenment. If every book was devoted to discussing criteria for historicity, we'd never make any progress. If it's any consolation, the criteria they apply to determine the true sayings and deeds of Jesus can also be applied (in some instances) to establish that there WAS a true Jesus. Much like the one I presented from Peter.
     lyth_ande : self-This is a side of you I've never seen before.
     bbrillo : no nothing..jesus is a myth because his life was stolen word for word from various pagan myths
     self_interest_speaks : lyth, yes you have J
     grapesofmelancholy : hot, i was exaggerating for comedic value, but you get my point
     self_interest_speaks : lyth, remember Lisa?
     rmugedn : lyth: roll in the mud for me bebe
     bbrillo : st paul never referred to jesus as histical
     phlegm_noir : brillo: no one is disputing these things. But we are still left with the wisdom tradition that underlies the synoptics.
     theophrenie : Muses are a beautiful mythology.
     colorofjanuary * LOVES that side of selfie!@
     lyth_ande : self-True enough. It still turns me on. M
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * notes that bbrillo has just hit the weak point in the historical Jesus argument.
     rmugedn * looks through his mythology boks
     larry_isley : prove it
     indondasani : bbrillo; the Jesus Seminar certainly seems to disagree.
     grapesofmelancholy : whenever someone comes in here with a name that contains "booty" or "69" or even "hot" they are almost always christian
     bbrillo : name on piece of evidence...one writter at the time...who mentioned jesus
     rmugedn : i think i only have norse and native american
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : however, Rom.1.3, Rom.1.9, Gal.1.19 (I think). . .
     rmugedn : one sec
     lyth_ande : rmug-No mud today, sorry.
     indondasani : ambassador; the silence of Paul you spoke of?
     hot_couple692003 : question grapes.....would Jesus have came and died even if noone believed in him???
     indondasani : grapes; hotvegasman?
     rara_avis91 : 8-|
     bbrillo : name a writer at the time of jesus who mentions him...anyone???
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Plus, the argument of Paul pertaining to resurrection in 1Cor (I forget the verse), does not hold unless Jesus was historical. . .physical body to spiritual body.
     bbrillo : one writer
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : indondasani: Yep.
     rara_avis91 : there were none
     phlegm_noir : Paul was not writing about jesus, a galilean preacher
     goD_oF_arrogancE : myles, he was not the son of god
     knight_of_baawa : myles, yeshua was a very common name. So what?
     grapesofmelancholy : indon, tis why i said "almost"
     phlegm_noir : Paul seems to be utterly unaware of the Jesus of the gospels.
     grapesofmelancholy : hot, i dont understand your question
     indondasani : grapes; I can think of about as many regulars with such things on either side.
     bbrillo : right..there are no mentions of jesus at the time he was said to have lived...not one word
     knight_of_baawa : Now you're just being silly, myles
     banana_annie : rmug....the kitties' eyes should be opening by now
     hot_couple692003 : grapes are you believer or no??
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : phlegm_noir: I think he was, and I think we can glean parts of the historical Jesus from the Pauline picture. It's difficult, because his christology was so high, but not impossible.
     bbrillo : no evidence...no writting...no nothing
     hot_couple692003 : just curious
     self_interest_speaks : Indon, Brillo seems to be ignoring you, too M
     indondasani : what I would say, is that non-regulars have a higher chance of manifesting such names.
     grapesofmelancholy : hot, nope
     rmugedn : ah
     goD_oF_arrogancE : myles, thats just your opinion, not mine
     rara_avis91 : myles...prove god exists, then prove jesus existed, then prove jesus was the son of said god you proved exists...do it now or please shut your trap about it
     rmugedn : found something
     eloheam_dammit : bible is a joke,hell playboy says she has double d's, that dont make them real........
     hot_couple692003 : well the ignore the question
     rmugedn : annie: you're right
     rmugedn : two of them are
     indondasani : self; well, I'm a deist anyway. Obviously his intellectual inferior.
     rmugedn : the other two still have to open up
     indondasani * chuckles.
     rmugedn : i just found out a few hours ago
     phlegm_noir : I disagree. Nothing in Paul's writing indicates he was aware of a Galilean named Jesus.
     lyth_ande : lol Indon
     bbrillo : Searched the web for jesus and mithras. Results 1 - 10 of about 7,610.
     self_interest_speaks : Indon, obviously.. that would be true even if you weren't a deist, lol
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : phlegm_noir: Rom.1.3?
     bbrillo : start reading
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : phlegm_noir: Gal.1.19?
     banana_annie * rmug is a catdaddy.....lol
     indondasani : self; well, if I wasn't a deist, I would obviously be a christian, I guess... just like ambassador.
     bbrillo : Searched the web for jesus and dionysus. Results 1 - 10 of about 10,700.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : phlegm_noir: His argument on resurrection? ("We will rise as Christ rose. . .physical body becomes a physical body") does not hold unless he refers to a real Jesus.
     phlegm_noir : I don't have a bible handy, rick. What are those references?
     bbrillo : jesus is a pagan myth..and thats why there is no evidence for him
     grapesofmelancholy : cripes, people assume that i am female and christian with this name. i guess no one reads steinbeck
     banana_annie : S I didn't know indon was a deist
     rara_avis91 : grapes...i didn't
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : "Descended from David, according to the flesh"(Gk. kata sarka).
     self_interest_speaks : Calgary is a fundie Christian. Everyone knows it.
     indondasani * has only said it a few times short of a billion in here.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : "James, the brother of the Lord."
     indondasani : self; and a YEC, too!
     theophrenie : " Still waters run deep. A little knowldege is a dangerous thing, drink deeply or not at all of the Pierian Springs" is a Greek mythological platitude based on the mythology of Greek waters containing mystical powers.
     grapesofmelancholy : rara, sweet
     hot_couple692003 : who the hell is calgary
     bbrillo : if anyone has an historical evidence for jesus now might be a good time to present it
     self_interest_speaks : lol, Indon, right
     rmugedn * found a section on musus
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : and the last one I named in the post.
     self_interest_speaks : hot_couple692003, Ambassador = Calgary
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * is Calgary.
     spherical_bastards : lol bbrillo
     spherical_bastards : die hard
     banana_annie : I'm good a dodging those sorts of announcements, indon.....J
     eloheam_dammit : this is the most humain war ever
     phlegm_noir : Well, my argument would be that the resurrection christology was borrowed from Paul by the evangelists.
     lyth_ande : Indon-That is a given. All christians are necesarily YECers.
     spherical_bastards : i read on the jesus seminar bbrillo you were right
     bbrillo : i dont see any evidence forthcoming
     indondasani : lyth; ah, yes. silly me.
     banana_annie : and you don't have an irritating font, indon.....it sometimes gets lost in the fray
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : phlegm_noir: There are others. But Paul isn't interested in an historical figure, so it's difficult to glean it all. He's interested in the spiritual Jesus in heaven, a distinction not made as clearly then as it is now.
     bbrillo : yes..the jesus seminar throws into disreput any attempt to make jesus historical
     rmugedn : does anyone know where the name "lycanthrope" comes from
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : phlegm_noir: I think they did, and I don't think Paul thought Jesus rose in the flesh.
     indondasani : oh, I can always go fundie-font...
     lyth_ande : Indon-I forgive you your error. After all, you have an inferior intellect, being a deist and everything.
     grapesofmelancholy : "whenever i had the jones for a kickass pina coloda i needed only to call for rick summer" -k marx
     praisejesus777 : Who is Jesus? ANSWERS to Muslim questions: http://www.answering-islam.org/Who/index.html Please bookmark this page and prayerfully consider the ANSWERS and EVIDENCE.
     banana_annie : nooooooooooo
     indondasani : lol lyth!
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Too much emphasis is placed on a spiritual resurrection, a spiritual body.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : The metaphor became doctrine.
     rmugedn : trying to remember where i heard it lasy
     rmugedn : last*
     indondasani : I could always type like THIS! MUA HA HA!
     theophrenie : Tell us.
     goD_oF_arrogancE : lol
     indondasani : though, this is probably harder to read than plain text.
     indondasani : but, that's really the idea.
     eloheam_dammit : last 5min's with bobv in office
     indondasani : btw, JESUS LOVES U ALL!
     bbrillo : and there were christian scholars when examined the gospels and came to the conclusion jesus was a "imaginative theological construct"
     indondasani : ok, that's enough of that.
     banana_annie * gets a headache
     indondasani * is shot.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * laughs at bbrillo.
     esotericx10 : indondasani Npo to mention that it will get you iggied too
     lyth_ande : Indon-That's just too scary.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : idiot.
     grapesofmelancholy * takes teh shooting back as the font is gone
     rara_avis91 * ignores half the room
     indondasani : lyth; it took much study to come upon just that combination of colors.
     celestial_zephyr : npo=nothing by mouth
     bbrillo : and since no one in this room has presented any evidence for a historical jesus perhaps the topic is closed
     lyth_ande : Indon-Scientifically designed to induce nausea?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * laughs and laughs.
     praisejesus777 : Who is Jesus? ANSWERS to Muslim questions: http://www.answering-islam.org/Who/index.html Please bookmark this page and prayerfully consider the ANSWERS and EVIDENCE.
     rara_avis91 : i'd say so
     redleg662002 : yes we did
     banana_annie : you weren't divinely inspired, indon
     indondasani : lyth; yes.
     eloheam_dammit : yes to that
     grapesofmelancholy : john, no thanks buddy
     spherical_bastards : bbrillo did you think they would have any ?
     bbrillo : how bout dem mets...rara?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * specifically recalls presenting a link to an argument for historicity presented by an expert.
     rara_avis91 : lol
     indondasani : banana; blame science.
     rara_avis91 : are the kitties eyes all open now?
     rmugedn : theo: found it
     bbrillo : no..i was being cute....spher
     lyth_ande : Indon-And very well designed, I might add.*grabs a bucket*
     bbrillo : teehee
     rmugedn : it's just a summary of the muses
     rmugedn : their names
     spherical_bastards : lol
     rmugedn : origins
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * laughs.
     rmugedn : nothing much else
     rara_avis91 : i can't wait a whole month to see them
     self_interest_speaks : Brillo, not likely.. the actual quote from the Jesus Seminar is "close historical analysis of the Gospels exposes most of them as inauthentic; that, by inference, most Christians' picture of Christ may be radically misguided. That their Jesus, in fact, 'is an imaginative theological construct' " Anyone with actual brains would realize that this only means that the idea of Jesus that most Christians have is a theological construct
     theophrenie : it's very easily seen that Chrsitianity is an extension of the Judaism, an extyension of the "scapegoat" atonement theology of the Jews. This is no coincidence.
     banana_annie : he blinded us with science
     redleg662002 : aproval rating 76 % bob, people love to have a war
     bbrillo : that beth is a little rip...rara
     self_interest_speaks : Brillo, but, as I said, that only pertains to people with brains.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds * notes that self_interest_speaks = correct.
     goD_oF_arrogancE : what is "teehee"?
     spherical_bastards : he says he has a link of an expert who we know will come from presupposition ..
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : spherical_bastards: Who? Me?
     spherical_bastards : so is it worthit bbrillo ?
     spherical_bastards : no
     grapesofmelancholy : people absolutely adore war. we need only look at our popular media to see this
     rara_avis91 : i can't wait to see her
     bbrillo : expert...yeah
     spherical_bastards : do you have one though ?
     bbrillo : expert
     phlegm_noir : brillo: your fundamentalist approach is giving us atheists a bad name.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : Peter Kirby is perhaps the most vociferous and least biased scholar on the internet.
     bbrillo : expert on jesus
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : For an argument for historicity?
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : yes.
     hot_couple692003 : the biggest ewvidence for Jesus is people like brillo and roome like this that clearly show that many people that claim not to believe spend alot of time trying to disprove something that doesnt exist
     bbrillo : that sounds promising
     banana_annie : tee hee = tittering laugh
     eloheam_dammit : dont mater were the w o m d come from but who has them.
     self_interest_speaks : Calgary, it was interesting how Brillo immediately went on a rant when challenged about that quotation... maybe he's dishonest, or perhaps he is like the rainman and something sent him into a ranting fit.
     bbrillo : <--expert on invisible red assed baboons
     rara_avis91 : lol
     spherical_bastards : damn
     spherical_bastards : give it rick
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : http://www.geocities.com/seeker_of_smooth_things/Peters_argument.htm
     indondasani : titter?
     hot_couple692003 : how many rooms are there that try to disprove santa calus
     rmugedn : chortle=chguckkle and snort
     rmugedn : chuckle*
     celestial_zephyr : that about al your gonna get on a saturday night brillo
     theophrenie : The world will learn, America cannnot be Warred against without a sever price to pay. America can wage war for 100 years , no problem.
     spherical_bastards : i will look it up
     bbrillo : santa claus isnt ruining peoples lives
     phlegm_noir : *Louis
     phlegm_noir : Carrol
     eloheam_dammit : santa is only in for the money
     bbrillo : belief in jesus is
     spherical_bastards : silly ....yes
     banana_annie * titters
     hot_couple692003 : whose life has ever been ruinmed by Jesus ar the belief in him??
     lyth_ande * laughs.
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : spherical_bastards: Besides which, relevant scholarship is unanimous in their acceptance of an historical Jesus. The only reasonable contention to it is Earl Doherty's and he's so marginalized, and refuses to publish in academic forums, that he really doesn't count.
     bbrillo : Atheists had the lowest average divorce rates (defined as the percentage of people who had been divorced at least once in their lives), at 21%. Christian divorce rates averaged about 24% (higher for "born-again" Christians, ie- fundamentalists, at 27%...the BARNA Report 1999
     indondasani : theo; um, yes, problem. America could wage a few years of war without the economy or society sustaining any substancial damage, though.
     rara_avis91 : hot...if you have to ask that question you are horribly brainwashed
     goD_oF_arrogancE : you worship santa as well?
     bbrillo : believe in jesus leads to divorce
     the_ambassador_in_bonds : spherical_bastards: There has been no scholarly question of Jesus' historicity since the enlightenment.
     

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